Long Island Man Arrested For Defending Family With An AK-47

[tombogan03884]

In the state of Texas, if someone is on your property and you believe them to be a threat to yourself, family, or possessions, you can use deadly force.  This guy didn't approach what I would consider the proper response to the situation, but he still ends up in jail. East coast City  is a bad place to be...

NY sure as hell ain't Texas. 

[Ichiban]

What he did was illegal even if he was afraid for his families safety.  He should be given a stern talking to and have to present to a judge or the police evidence (some targets from the range) to show that he is capable with his weapon.

[tombogan03884]

Mandatory NRA class (es ) and a Best Defense Box set  

One thing from the article though, should probably be discussed in the Defense and Tactics Forum.
FTA;

"Grier said the five men dared him to use the gun;"

My solution is a bean bag or some such as the first round, I know "rubber bullets" are available in several calibers.
While the first loud mouth is nursing his welt, you can politely point out that, Yes, you will shoot.

[TAB]

I beleave firing a warning shot is techincally illegal every where. 

There has to be alot more to this story.

[m25operator]

I don't believe in warning shots, and I don't believe in threatening, Personally I would have retreated and took up a good defensive position and awaited police response, if they came through the door, well then its time to act, act hard and fast make it all count. At the most on initial contact, told them in no small way to leave my property, police are on their way. Then back in the house, lock the doors, keep 911 on the phone, putting shots into the ground impresses no one, and achieves nothing. I don't think he deserves jail time, but does need someone to take him aside and ask, WTF were you going to do?? He was escalating, not deescalating, I am not going to take on 20+ individuals in my front yard, with any weapon, hide and watch and wait. Hide behind hard cover.

[Sponsor]

[billt]

So if the police were there in minutes, what happened to these "20 or 30 gang members"? Were they detained and their immigration status checked? Were they found to be here illegally? Were they members of "MS-13"? Did ICE get involved? You read this story and it's like the perpetrators didn't exist, or else they vanished into thin air?? Something stinks.  Bill T.

[m25operator]

Something stinks, oh yes.

[fightingquaker13]

I hate to armchair quarter back this stuff. But, assuming the facts are correct, the guy was scared and pissed and with good reason. Problem is, pissed overrode scared. Scared will keep you out of jail, pissed gets you locked up. Why go outside? Why respond to verbal confrontation by shooting? The cops were on the way, and your family was inside. Why weren't you? Why be the first to fire when yours was the only gun visible?  As others have stated  he should not be locked up. Also, he was under loads of stress and can be forgiven for not thinking things through as carefully as we can here. Still, its worth playing devil's advocate for a bit. Every question I asked the DA will ask. It just seems that if you can stay inside your home with the cops on the phone and only shoot if they enter, even in NY, the law is on your side. Go outside and escalate? Not a good idea, as the jury will have to ask itself why you left the safety of your home and started firing warning shots.
FQ13 who hopes the guy gets off, but there is a lesson to be learned here. Make them come to you.

[billt]

What I find interesting is when you compare the laws of different states regarding this sort of thing directly to an incident such as this one, and how the legal dust settles afterward. A good example would be comparing this incident to the Joe Horn incident in Texas where a citizen took matters into his own hands and shot and killed 2 men who were burglarizing his neighbors home, and were absolutely a total zero threat to him personally.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Horn_shooting_controversy

In Long Island N.Y. this guy is gutted, filleted, and fried for simply firing a few warning shots at 20 to 30 gang members who were in the process of terrorizing his family. This is where the NRA, along with the Republican right needs to exercise their effort in getting some of these silly municipal gun laws changed so this country has a more of a legal, level playing field when something like this takes place.

Look at how lopsided these laws are. This poor guy in N.Y. could go away on felony charges, and very well might especially if some left wing, anti gun prosecutor gets his or her hands on this and decides to make an example out of him for political purposes. Remember New York is, and always has been, extremely anti gun, and is the home of Michael Bloomberg and Charles Schumer. These guys are 2 of the most rabid anti gun politicians on planet Earth. Bloomberg has a history of putting anti gun matters in the spotlight to set examples. Remember his New Jersey gun shop law suit debacle?

On the other hand Joe Horn walked and was not even charged because the prosecutor doubted they could win the case. This in spite of the fact Horn was on the phone with a 911 Operator at the time, and told the operator he was going to put the phone down, and go outside and shoot both of the perps, which is exactly what he did. Also, there was supposedly a police officer present in his car who witnessed the whole thing! If this had happened to the Long Island guy, they'd lock him up and throw away the key for good! This is bull$h!t when you have such drastically different opposing laws in the same country regarding guns and self defense of property and persons. This is a classic example of what happens when you have too many lawyers involved in a legal system. It becomes a train wreck. Joe Horn is probably making money off of this whole deal, (which there is nothing wrong with), and the Long Island guy will more than likely go bankrupt from legal expenses this will in fact generate. All from within the same borders of the same country. Totally ridiculous.   Bill T.

[fightingquaker13]

Tell that to the Framers Bill. On the one hand you are right, on the other you need to be reminded that we are FEDERAL republic. The laws in Mississippi and Massachusetts vary because the culture differs. Gay in Ms. and feeling oppressed because you cant marry your sweetie? Cambridge Mass. is a nice town. Disgusted in Mass. by the married lesbians living next door? Cambridge Ms. is likewise a pretty nice place (with better weather).
The gun issue is tricky becuse the 2A is a national right. Therefore local laws should not be allowed to vary very much, at least in that there should be a minimum floor, but hopefully not a maximum ceiling, for gun rights. However, when it comes to SD, local culture will always prevail. What would get you prosecuted in NYC will cause a Tx. prosecuter to shrug and ask "What did the guy expect was going to happen"? I'm not sure this a bad thing. I don't want our gun rights set by the lowest common denominator. Don't like your state's laws? Its easy to move.
FQ13 who just throws this out for discussion's sake