Constitutional Thoughts To Ponder

[runstowin]

Recently I made the comment that I often disagree with Runstowin, this is one of them.
His suggestion shows a shallow understanding of the symptom and total ignorance of the actual problem.
If followed, his idea of doing away with public school would reserve education only for those who could afford it.
This would lead to an aristocratic educated class calling the shot's for the "ignorant masses"..
This mentality being held by the socialists who currently lurk in academia is at the root of many of the problems we face today, such as an elitist legislature that ignores the demands of it's employers, US, ( Obummercare ).
They are there to teach kids to read, write, and do math. College professors are supposed to be educating young people in more advanced studies, not pushing a political agenda (marxism ) and encouraging dissent, (exact quote from a local communist Professor "A professor greatest contribution is to encourage dissenting opinions " It came from a local paper a year or 2 back )
In fact, rather than encouraging dissent they should be teaching their students to be competent citizens but most of them lack that knowledge themselves.
The answer is to return control of education to the local level, purge the socialist "activists" and do away with tenure.

Spoken like a true socialist/communist, supporting the 10th plank of the Communist Manifesto. Just what free people need, government funded and government controlled education, read indoctrination. In Godless, faceless government bureaucrats, you trust. No wonder this education system is infused with Marxist/socialists, the very construct is Marxist/socialist.

[tombogan03884]

Spoken like a true socialist/communist, supporting the 10th plank of the Communist Manifesto. Just what free people need, government funded and government controlled education, read indoctrination. In Godless, faceless government bureaucrats, you trust. No wonder this education system is infused with Marxist/socialists, the very construct is Marxist/socialist.

Oh bite me.
Funny that Public education in the US predates Marx, Engels and even Hegel by about 75 years.
You have a lot of complaints, but I don't here you ever coming up with any solutions of your own.
You still don't get it, YOU are part of the problem.
The reason the athiests and communists were able to infiltrate the education system was because cowards like you let them, you ran away to half assed home schooling, or private schools instead of acting like a man and standing up for you alleged beliefs.
Were you ever in the PTA, did you run for the school board, did you even have the guts to write a letter to the editor ?
People like you deserve what you let happen to you.
And if you want to call ME a Communist, your stupid as well as lazy.

[fightingquaker13]

A followup. Everybody with an agenda, from Plato onwards hs tried to use the education system to further it. The whole "Give me a child when he's seven and I'll own him for life" thing is hardly new and its damn sure not exclusive to the Marxists. Why do you think the Evangelicals, Mormons, Catholics, Quakers, Muslims etc are so fired up abot it? Fact is though, folks with agendas have complained about schools following a different agenda from theirs for as long as there have been schools, and we've all pretty much turned out ok.  
As a college prof? My first job ist to teach kids how to think for themselves, how to question agendas. If I were King of Education for a day, every high school and certainly every college would require three classes.
A basic US History course.
A class on US politics and the political theory behind it.
But above all, a course on basic logic and rhetoric. It would teach them logical fallacies and rhetorical styles. That alone would save the republic a lot of grief and go a long ways toward thwarting the attempts of "group x" to propagandize the students.
FQ13

[JC5123]

A followup. Everybody with an agenda, from Plato onwards hs tried to use the education system to further it. The whole "Give me a child when he's seven and I'll own him for life" thing is hardly new and its damn sure not exclusive to the Marxists. Why do you think the Evangelicals, Mormons, Catholics, Quakers, Muslims etc are so fired up abot it? Fact is though, folks with agendas have complained about schools following a different agenda from theirs for as long as there have been schools, and we've all pretty much turned out ok.  
As a college prof? My first job ist to teach kids how to think for themselves, how to question agendas. If I were King of Education for a day, every high school and certainly every college would require three classes.
A basic US History course.
A class on US politics and the political theory behind it.
But above all, a course on basic logic and rhetoric. It would teach them logical fallacies and rhetorical styles. That alone would save the republic a lot of grief and go a long ways toward thwarting the attempts of "group x" to propagandize the students.
FQ13

While I like your idea, I don't see where it will work. At least not in the current system. The problem is in the fact that while we have figured out the a person needs to be able to READ their diploma. Many still wouldn't be able to comprehend logic or rhetoric.

It would be like asking a liberal to back up their position with facts and logic. 

[tombogan03884]

I was going to say to heck with this thread, but I have to comment that FQ raises some good points.
Considering that the vast majority of members on this forum are products of the evil public school system I'd have to say the indoctrination bit hasn't worked out to well except for those who are really to lazy to research or think for themselves.
We used to have the classes FQ, talks about, Civics, and History. Logic is like common sense though, not so common.
Rhetoric ? basically the art of forming a coherent argument ? In today's political atmosphere that is the last thing politicians want people to do, otherwise we might expect them to know what's in a bill BEFORE they pass it, not the other way around.

[Sponsor]

[jaybet]

There's a factor no one here has mentioned....the fact that most kids in public schools think their teachers are lard-ass dolts. They're not the least bit interested in anything the teacher has to say, so unless he or she is VERY engaging it goes in one ear and out the other. So maybe that's why the liberal message doesn't get through as much as you would think...because the kids will do the opposite of whatever the teacher says.

[MikeBjerum]

There's a factor no one here has mentioned....the fact that most kids in public schools think their teachers are lard-ass dolts. They're not the least bit interested in anything the teacher has to say, so unless he or she is VERY engaging it goes in one ear and out the other. So maybe that's why the liberal message doesn't get through as much as you would think...because the kids will do the opposite of whatever the teacher says.

This is where I have mixed feelings.  I was meeting with a customer today, and we talked about what our world was like.  How we would have been treated if we showed anywhere near the lack of respect that runs rampant today. 

Personally, I would prefer to prepare the kids for the liberal bias and counter it than to have them learn to not respect a teacher. 

Lack of respect, leads to lack of love, and on to lack of care which equals HATE.  I'm not saying that we have lost it all in one or two generations, but it is one of the mud slides on the hillside we are sliding down.  And like any out of control ride, we are going faster and faster with each passing year.

"Lack of respect, leads to lack of love, and on to lack of care which equals HATE. "  Isn't this where this started - Hate crimes legislation and the division it causes?  I thought it was supposed to legislate unity and love?  Guess you can't legislate morality.

[twyacht]

I was given "Internal Suspension" in 8th grade Civics class, because I disagreed with the teacher, with the handling of the Iranian Hostage Crises by than POTUS, Jimmy Carter,..."I was just quoting my Father's evening rant(s) about a dumb ass peanut farmer's foreign policy."

After that, I was told "I" had a problem taking Political Science at Appalachian State University, because of an increasing entitlement policy, and the theft that is Social Security..

Sorry, the indoctrination FAILED with me, AND my 15 year old son.....My younger sister, however, is a card carrying, union representing, teacher, who voted for BHO....

I am still trying to "fix" her....

[tt11758]

I was given "Internal Suspension" in 8th grade Civics class, because I disagreed with the teacher, with the handling of the Iranian Hostage Crises by than POTUS, Jimmy Carter,..."I was just quoting my Father's evening rant(s) about a dumb ass peanut farmer's foreign policy."

After that, I was told "I" had a problem taking Political Science at Appalachian State University, because of an increasing entitlement policy, and the theft that is Social Security..

Sorry, the indoctrination FAILED with me, AND my 15 year old son.....My younger sister, however, is a card carrying, union representing, teacher, who voted for BHO....

I am still trying to "fix" her....

To quote Ron White, "You can't fix stupid."

[tombogan03884]

Count me with TW. My sister is a Liberal PhD at a college in Texas, but she aks me to explain stuff to her on occasion, then gets pissed when I do