Liberal fascism

[tombogan03884]

Pioneer, I agree with everything you said,EXCEPT about McCain. Some one else said it first, but it is possible that the Manchurian candidate could be WORSE than Obama or Clinton. If either of them attempt any restrictions then MOST republicans will resist simply because they belong to the other party, same with Civic and Conservative Religious Leaders, HOWEVER, if that RINO rat is pres and tries the same thing, (which he has in the past IE "gun show loophole") the resistance will be shattered because he's NOT from the other party. In congress and the senate party loyalty is what gets you on committees. Committees are where the pork is, and most of those parasites would not be there if not for the pork. Even Jews and Muslims eat up that kind.

[Rastus]

Pioneer, I agree with everything you said,EXCEPT about McCain. Some one else said it first, but it is possible that the Manchurian candidate could be WORSE than Obama or Clinton. If either of them attempt any restrictions then MOST republicans will resist simply because they belong to the other party, same with Civic and Conservative Religious Leaders, HOWEVER, if that RINO rat is pres and tries the same thing, (which he has in the past IE "gun show loophole") the resistance will be shattered because he's NOT from the other party. In ................"

Well said. 

I think looking at the invasion passing over our southern border and the Amicus Brief of D.C. vs. Heller, and a couple of other things, that the traitor Bush has done more harm than Gore or Kerry would have (you have no idea how much it hurts to say that).  Everyone knew where Gore and Kerry were coming from.....but Bush sold us out.  "Read my lips...", G.W, err, no G.H Bush....oh well, fruit falling close to the tree trunk or whatever.

I thought I was doing the right thing voting for the lesser of two evils and voted for GW.  The lesser of two evils is still evil....as was so aptly put by Michael Bane. 

I think, as much as I dislike the Democratic candidates, that McCain has the potential for greater harm....once again, I'd rather get punched in the face then stabbed in the back.  And it's not that I think I can avoid either, it is just I prefer getting punched in the face....something about backstabbing by "one of your own" that I don't like. 

If McCain is the candidate, I'm staying home because I won't vote for him and can't vote for the Democratic candidate.

By the way, Tom, we could do a lot for airport security if only we required some flights to be "pork eaters" and others to not be.  The Muslims have some kind of cleansing ritual for eating pork....not too likely to fly into buildings with oinker grease in their guts....

[tombogan03884]

By the way, Tom, we could do a lot for airport security if only we required some flights to be "pork eaters" and others to not be.  The Muslims have some kind of cleansing ritual for eating pork....not too likely to fly into buildings with oinker grease in their guts....

Fly El Al whenever possible, those Israeli's think like us. The best way to protect yourself is to PROTECT  yourself.
Please don't stay home on election day ! Write in Ron Paul, even if you HATE all his other positions, he is solid on the second amendment . Even if he does not win, every vote he gets increases the impact of the message to the "major parties" that we are sick of them.

[Pathfinder]

Well said. 

I think looking at the invasion passing over our southern border and the Amicus Brief of D.C. vs. Heller, and a couple of other things, that the traitor Bush has done more harm than Gore or Kerry would have (you have no idea how much it hurts to say that).  Everyone knew where Gore and Kerry were coming from.....but Bush sold us out.  "Read my lips...", G.W, err, no G.H Bush....oh well, fruit falling close to the tree trunk or whatever.

I thought I was doing the right thing voting for the lesser of two evils and voted for GW.  The lesser of two evils is still evil....as was so aptly put by Michael Bane. 

I think, as much as I dislike the Democratic candidates, that McCain has the potential for greater harm....once again, I'd rather get punched in the face then stabbed in the back.  And it's not that I think I can avoid either, it is just I prefer getting punched in the face....something about backstabbing by "one of your own" that I don't like. 

If McCain is the candidate, I'm staying home because I won't vote for him and can't vote for the Democratic candidate.

By the way, Tom, we could do a lot for airport security if only we required some flights to be "pork eaters" and others to not be.  The Muslims have some kind of cleansing ritual for eating pork....not too likely to fly into buildings with oinker grease in their guts....

The reality is that they will all be bad, unimaginably so. As we were blindsided by Bush and the SG brief, we will be blindsided by everything that any of these people do while in the White House. I am of the opinion that the last 16 years have just been a prelude, and that we cannot even imagine what kinds of bad stuff will come out of Washington in the next 8 years, just that it will be bad.

[tombogan03884]

The reality is that they will all be bad, unimaginably so. As we were blindsided by Bush and the SG brief, we will be blindsided by everything that any of these people do while in the White House. I am of the opinion that the last 16 years have just been a prelude, and that we cannot even imagine what kinds of bad stuff will come out of Washington in the next 8 years, just that it will be bad.

If we go into it not trusting ANYTHING any of those socialists say then HOPEFULLY they won't be able to "blindside" us. SUPREME COURT DECISIONS AND LEGISLATION ARE IRRELEVANT, "RIGHTS" ARE NOT GRANTED BY THE CONSTITUTION, ONLY RECOGNIZED.  The Declaration of independence states "that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights," The Bill of rights simply itemizes the rights in a more specific form, they are not open to interpretation, legislation, regulation, or any other form of infringement. See Miranda v Arizona, "When rights secured by the constitution are involved, there can be no rule making or legislation which would abrogate them." Cockburn v State of Texas, "The right of the individual to bear arms in defense of the state or himself is absolute. He does not derive it from the Government. It is one of the "high powers" delegated directly to the citizen, and is excepted out of the general powers  of government. A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, Because it is above the law and independent of lawmaking power.
Those are just 2 examples, many more exist, victim disarmament is illegal as well as immoral. I don't care who gets elected, I ain't surrendering squat, and I intend to be in peoples faces about it. I don't care what kind of socialist dream world some bubble headed ass lives in they do NOT have the right to change my constitutional rights, THAT IS WHY THEY WERE SPECIFIED. If I offend people I can only say "GOOD", if I scare people I can only ask "What do YOU have in mind that my insistence on MY rights scares you.

[Sponsor]

[jerry]

If we go into it not trusting ANYTHING any of those socialists say then HOPEFULLY they won't be able to "blindside" us. SUPREME COURT DECISIONS AND LEGISLATION ARE IRRELEVANT, "RIGHTS" ARE NOT GRANTED BY THE CONSTITUTION, ONLY RECOGNIZED.  The Declaration of independence states "that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights," The Bill of rights simply itemizes the rights in a more specific form, they are not open to interpretation, legislation, regulation, or any other form of infringement. See Miranda v Arizona, "When rights secured by the constitution are involved, there can be no rule making or legislation which would abrogate them." Cockburn v State of Texas, "The right of the individual to bear arms in defense of the state or himself is absolute. He does not derive it from the Government. It is one of the "high powers" delegated directly to the citizen, and is excepted out of the general powers  of government. A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, Because it is above the law and independent of lawmaking power.
Those are just 2 examples, many more exist, victim disarmament is illegal as well as immoral. I don't care who gets elected, I ain't surrendering squat, and I intend to be in peoples faces about it. I don't care what kind of socialist dream world some bubble headed ass lives in they do NOT have the right to change my constitutional rights, THAT IS WHY THEY WERE SPECIFIED. If I offend people I can only say "GOOD", if I scare people I can only ask "What do YOU have in mind that my insistence on MY rights scares you.

I say Tom Bogan for U.S. Supreme Court Justice.  You think Obama will nominate him?

[Pathfinder]

If we go into it not trusting ANYTHING any of those socialists say then HOPEFULLY they won't be able to "blindside" us. SUPREME COURT DECISIONS AND LEGISLATION ARE IRRELEVANT, "RIGHTS" ARE NOT GRANTED BY THE CONSTITUTION, ONLY RECOGNIZED.  The Declaration of independence states "that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights," The Bill of rights simply itemizes the rights in a more specific form, they are not open to interpretation, legislation, regulation, or any other form of infringement. See Miranda v Arizona, "When rights secured by the constitution are involved, there can be no rule making or legislation which would abrogate them." Cockburn v State of Texas, "The right of the individual to bear arms in defense of the state or himself is absolute. He does not derive it from the Government. It is one of the "high powers" delegated directly to the citizen, and is excepted out of the general powers  of government. A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, Because it is above the law and independent of lawmaking power.
Those are just 2 examples, many more exist, victim disarmament is illegal as well as immoral. I don't care who gets elected, I ain't surrendering squat, and I intend to be in peoples faces about it. I don't care what kind of socialist dream world some bubble headed ass lives in they do NOT have the right to change my constitutional rights, THAT IS WHY THEY WERE SPECIFIED. If I offend people I can only say "GOOD", if I scare people I can only ask "What do YOU have in mind that my insistence on MY rights scares you.

Good points all, tombogon, and I agree.

There have been a number of posts and threads here about what happens is this "soft" war should turn hard and these thoughts have to be turned into actions. I honestly think that is the direction we're heading, and there is damn little we can do now to stop it, especially with the candidates we have offered to us. Not one is qualified to be President, not one is even thinkable as CINC.

I am going to steal your last line for my use. Just thought I'd let you know.

[Rastus]

Good points all, tombogon, and I agree.

There have been a number of posts and threads here about what happens is this "soft" war should turn hard and these thoughts have to be turned into actions. I honestly think that is the direction we're heading, and there is damn little we can do now to stop it, especially with the candidates we have offered to us. Not one is qualified to be President, not one is even thinkable as CINC.  ...........

Tom, you make great points.  I just think it's time to hunker down...the battle is lost without an aroused populace and, I think, that's going to take punishment....high taxes, property confiscation, job loss,...i.e., their ox being gored and losing their "good life.

Pathfinder, I never heard the terms you put it in...but I'm in with you.

There is a time for civil disobedience and that may not be when governments first start to assert themselves in stealing God-given rights.  Let the people who just woke up (i.e., the dumb asses who had it good and wouldn't get off the couch, wouldn't support the NRA or who voted for someone to get a $ or a ticket fixed) with the loud mouths get the boot on the neck and gun butt in the teeth.  If big brother knocks on your door that may not be the time to make a stand....especially if they have the numbers and you didn't know they were coming.  Not that right-out-of-the-box won't be the best time....just at your front door with your family inside(?)...you maybe want to hand in a few and have records showing where the rest went.   I don't know if those people I sold the guns to were giving me their right name or not, but I know they are good people and have the name and address they gave me....I do have that list just in case here in the next few years.  Bureaucrats need paper and I aim to please them.  I planning on paying my taxes, living smart not dying stupid.

Strange now, how people who never had an interest are buying AK's and AR's.  I'm an engineer, got a Masters degree in engineering from Tulane in New Orleans  and am simply knocked off my feet by the people who may have had an old shotgun or .22 and thought that was maybe overkill.....who now have AR's and a couple of thousand rounds not too mention gold and silver at home in the safe.  They thought I was nuts a year or two ago...just because I'm a collector who likes guns.  Lots of licensed professional engineers, doctors I know, etc. who now have AR's, AK's and a bunch of ammo who didn't have it a year or two ago.  I bought 'em because I like 'em and they are fun to shoot...these newcomers who were looking down on me don't share my shooting enthusiasm...why are they buying them?

[DDMac]

Up early. Too much coffee. Let me speak to this as well. Tom's last line is the window to the future and key to what changes are coming. Most here believe that money is the usual motive for major initiatives, by individual or government. I think that is the case here also. There is a publishes presentation by David M. Walker called America's Fiscal Future. A call for Citizen Involvement that convinces me of the direction of any political party that gains the power of the Presidency AND Congress. The U.S. is backed way out on a monetary plank and we are sawing it off behind us as fast as we can.

Simply put, we have spent non-existent capital in failed attempts to provide all the government services WANTED, not needed, by the clamoring masses. Politicians promise it and their election requires it. Problem is, we can't afford it. Health care, Social Security, Postal Service, railroads, cost of government operations, war, nation building, extraordinary corporate corruption requiring government bailouts, have broken the bank. There is a big, brick economic wall coming and we are in need of speed brakes right now. Mr. Walker explains that it is still fixable,but there needs to be changes in how the regular citizen views his role in society.

From what I've read of the forum members, you are pretty much self-made individualists, fiercely self reliant, honorable, resourceful and reliable citizens who have paid our dues to enjoy what you have earned. Clearly, people of that mindset have become a dwindling minority since WWII. You pull the wagon, load and unload it, and provide the bounty it carries. You have also borne the weight of those fellow citizens (and anyone inside the border) who are permitted to simply ride in the wagon. Everyone in a position to do something about it realizes this must stop. The suggested fix will not sit well with either the riders OR the pullers of the wagon. The Walker article points to the fantastic success of fiscal reforms in other countries as a beacon of hope to steer toward. He offers up the examples of Australia and New Zealand as guideposts.

The military is an armed force, sort of like the armed citizen militia, except that the military is no democracy. The Uniform Code of Military Justice insures that order will be maintained by those selected to lead. The U.S. citizen cannot be so compelled to comply with orders given by those selected to lead. We have the Constitution-and guns! As Mr. Walker's report foreshadows, the government, in an attempt to save the economy from collapse, will have to be in a position to issue orders, like a military general, to be followed without question, in order to reshape the economic landscape. People will need to assume a predetermined role in society to provide government with human resources where and in what numbers they determine necessary. Call it Public Service, sounds good. There can be no argument, and no explanation is necessary. Want to be an artist? Nope, don't need'em. You will be an auto mechanic. Doctor? Fine, you will practice internal medicine and your license will be issued in New Jersey. Period. You wouldn't understand the big picture anyway.

So, how does government position itself where it can issue orders, effecting the lives and individual futures of every citizen, in a Democratic Republic? First, they must eliminate the tools of effective dissent. Then, they may direct your actions and choices with relative impunity. Sure, you may attempt to sue on Constitutional grounds, but in the mean time, get back to your assigned duties. By the way, your withholding needs to go up some more. Australia?  New Zealand? Great examples indeed.

I'm not suggesting that spending can continue as in the past, but you have heard the campaign promises. Universal health care, lower taxes, world peace,more, more, more...  So, how's that going to work? It will be converted from the fruits of YOUR labor, for the benefit of ALL, disproportionately and involuntarily in some cases.

It is a solution, and it would work, but at what cost to people like those here this morning? That, Tom, is what I think they have in mind.

Mac.