33 Years Instead Of Some Good Kentucky Rope For A Pirate

[TAB]

TABs right on this, rattiest buildings and worst streets in Alameda County. Most litter, etc.

full of dirty hippies...


yes there is a diffrence between a hippie and a dirty hippy

[MikeBjerum]

The plot thickens:

http://www.startribune.com/nation/116506813.html

Somalia's UN Mission says pirates
hijacked a yacht carrying 4 US
citizens


Associated Press

Last update: February 18, 2011 - 6:23 PM

UNITED NATIONS - Somalia's U.N. Mission
said Friday that pirates hijacked a yacht
carrying four U.S. citizens in the Indian
Ocean off the Somali coast.

Omar Jamal, first secretary at the Somali
mission, identified the yacht as the S/V
Quest.

[twyacht]

Best of luck to them, as they are most likely completely unarmed. Unlike some other yachts I have worked on, most have no anti piracy plan for defense.

What a difference a couple of AR's, AK's, Shotguns, high cap pistols,...SOMETHING!!!! But alas,.....

_ Gun Owning Vessel
_ Victim

Seems they chose wrong.

[fightingquaker13]

I am generally not a blood thirsty type (well, not by this boards standards anyway, although I was the house war monger in any college I ever taught at ), BUT here's the thing. Piracy only prospers when the pirates have a safe port. Now I know that living in Somalia sucks. If I lived there and ran a small business in a port city, seeing pirates with lots of money to spend and guns to keep the warlords off my back would seem like a great deal. Hell, what do I care about a bunch of foreiners? What have they done other than made us a target of colonialism and a particularly cynical pawn in their Cold War? Why shouldn't I help them?
 
In order to change that way of thinking, I'm afraid sweet reason won't work. Bomb the crap out the waterfronts of the cities that shelter pirated vessels. Civilians will die (that's kind of the point) and hostages will be killed. But after you do it once, the peasants with pitch forks will tell the prates to go elsewhere as they won't want to be next. Its the only way to make this thing go away. No ports=No pirates. A friendly port=pirates.
FQ13

[deepwater]

I am generally not a blood thirsty type (well, not by this boards standards anyway, although I was the house war monger in any college I ever taught at ), BUT here's the thing. Piracy only prospers when the pirates have a safe port. Now I know that living in Somalia sucks. If I lived there and ran a small business in a port city, seeing pirates with lots of money to spend and guns to keep the warlords off my back would seem like a great deal. Hell, what do I care about a bunch of foreiners? What have they done other than made us a target of colonialism and a particularly cynical pawn in their Cold War? Why shouldn't I help them?
 
In order to change that way of thinking, I'm afraid sweet reason won't work. Bomb the crap out the waterfronts of the cities that shelter pirated vessels. Civilians will die (that's kind of the point) and hostages will be killed. But after you do it once, the peasants with pitch forks will tell the prates to go elsewhere as they won't want to be next. Its the only way to make this thing go away. No ports=No pirates. A friendly port=pirates.
FQ13

good reason not to do it that way.
you got some sand saying that when one of us is in pirate waters FQ. they are small boats attached to a larger mother vessel that poses as a fishing vessel. which ones are they? where do they come from? easy to hide and the larger vessel can be supplied by smaller faster boats, or the larger boats can resupply while the the little speed boats wait at sea. the little bastard are well organised for a bunch of third world thugs. and if someone gave an order that put myself and shipmates in danger of being killed by our own side, and they know it.... better get us all and they  better watch out.
if you're willing to kill the people you're trying to protect, then why even bother? just let the dirty little pirates do their thing, we would have a better chance than if FQ was in charge.

[Sponsor]

[Timothy]

Deepwater,

I'm only one guy but if the pirates get you, I'll volunteer myself to come a get you back.

Leave no American behind has been something I've believed in my entire life...no reason to stop now!

[fightingquaker13]

good reason not to do it that way.
you got some sand saying that when one of us is in pirate waters FQ. they are small boats attached to a larger mother vessel that poses as a fishing vessel. which ones are they? where do they come from? easy to hide and the larger vessel can be supplied by smaller faster boats, or the larger boats can resupply while the the little speed boats wait at sea. the little bastard are well organised for a bunch of third world thugs. and if someone gave an order that put myself and shipmates in danger of being killed by our own side, and they know it.... better get us all and they  better watch out.
if you're willing to kill the people you're trying to protect, then why even bother? just let the dirty little pirates do their thing, we would have a better chance than if FQ was in charge.

No offense Deepwater but it boils down to this. Clausewitz had it right when he said that "The object of war is to destroy your enemy's will to resist". Anything else is wishful thinking. If you can come up with a way to deter the pirates from attacking, protect civilians and cause other Somalis to stop backing them (which is what makes them viable), then I'd like to hear it. From my POV (which is admittedly a lot less exposed than yours) we have two choices. One, fight them on the high seas, which as you just pointed out is an iffy thing. Option two, hit them where they live and turn the populace against them. War has costs. Mariners have always paid them as have civilians. Look at WWII. How many merchant mariners died in the North Atlantic and how many civilians died from bombs? I don't take this lightly. The only question is this. Could we, should we, have done anything differently? Colin Powell had it right when he said "The greatest inhuanity of war is the condition of war itself. Therefore, we should use all means to end a war as quicly as possible".
Respectfully
FQ13

[deepwater]

Deepwater,

I'm only one guy but if the pirates get you, I'll volunteer myself to come a get you back.

Leave no American behind has been something I've believed in my entire life...no reason to stop now!

Thanks Timothy, though I think that if they did get aboard this ship and end up taking us, some of us would end up dead from trying to deter the little spit wads.
 

No offense Deepwater but it boils down to this. Clausewitz had it right when he said that "The object of war is to destroy your enemy's will to resist". Anything else is wishful thinking. If you can come up with a way to deter the pirates from attacking, protect civilians and cause other Somalis to stop backing them (which is what makes them viable), then I'd like to hear it. From my POV (which is admittedly a lot less exposed than yours) we have two choices. One, fight them on the high seas, which as you just pointed out is an iffy thing. Option two, hit them where they live and turn the populace against them. War has costs. Mariners have always paid them as have civilians. Look at WWII. How many merchant mariners died in the North Atlantic and how many civilians died from bombs? I don't take this lightly. The only question is this. Could we, should we, have done anything differently? Colin Powell had it right when he said "The greatest inhuanity of war is the condition of war itself. Therefore, we should use all means to end a war as quicly as possible".
Respectfully
FQ13

piracy may seem like war for some of us, but they are nothing more than thugs. to be dealt with accordingly. they represent nobody and only answer to themselves. kill them. arm our ships and our sailors, THAT, will deter or effectively deal with them as they come. the little douche bags are attacking more than one ship per day. take several per week. let's arm ourselves and deal with them here. to attack their ports and the civilians would be like bombing Detroit because tourists keep getting mugged and kidnapped or murdered. sound about right?would piss off the remaining population, but would do nothing to the thugs. (though bombing Detroit does sound like good fun) 
well, gotta go now, must get a little rest as tomorrow we transit the Suez canal. woopeee!

deepwater

[Timothy]

Fair Winds DW.....

safe passage expected.  North or south?

[fightingquaker13]

Thanks Timothy, though I think that if they did get aboard this ship and end up taking us, some of us would end up dead from trying to deter the little spit wads.
 piracy may seem like war for some of us, but they are nothing more than thugs. to be dealt with accordingly. they represent nobody and only answer to themselves. kill them. arm our ships and our sailors, THAT, will deter or effectively deal with them as they come. the little douche bags are attacking more than one ship per day. take several per week. let's arm ourselves and deal with them here. to attack their ports and the civilians would be like bombing Detroit because tourists keep getting mugged and kidnapped or murdered. sound about right?would piss off the remaining population, but would do nothing to the thugs. (though bombing Detroit does sound like good fun) 
well, gotta go now, must get a little rest as tomorrow we transit the Suez canal. woopeee!

deepwater

Point taken Deepwater. I just gues that the numbers you posted sound a lot like war, just like the Barbary pirates of the Marine Corps Hymn. Still, you are right, they are apolitical (mostly thugs). I may be wrong in my approach, I just don't see much alternative, although I am 4 square in favor of putting a fire team with heavy weapons aboard any US flagged vessel. As far as the Suez, have fun and enjoy the sights. Get your picture taken with that Iranian frigate if you can.
FQ13