Author Topic: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight  (Read 6509 times)

Marshal Halloway

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Re: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight
« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2008, 01:17:22 PM »
From The Washington Times:
"The pilot has to take his gun off and lock it up before he leaves the cockpit, so he was trying to secure the gun in preparation for landing, while he was trying to fly the airplane, too," said David Mackett, president of the Airline Pilots Security Alliance. "In the process of doing that, the padlock that is required to be inserted into the holster pulled the trigger and caused the gun to discharge."

Faulty rules blamed for gun's firing
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080328/NATION/927995814/1002

See also Michael's blog post:
TSA Stupidity Puts Pilots At Risk!
http://michaelbane.blogspot.com/2008/03/tsa-stupidity-puts-pilots-at-risk.html


Fuzzy

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Re: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight
« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2008, 04:42:54 PM »
Lets see if I can remember the rules for using trigger locks?

1. BE SURE GUN IS NOT LOADED

2. BE SURE CHAMBER IS EMPTY

"THE RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS"

Hazcat

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Re: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight
« Reply #22 on: March 28, 2008, 04:45:39 PM »
Lets see if I can remember the rules for using trigger locks?

1. BE SURE GUN IS NOT LOADED

2. BE SURE CHAMBER IS EMPTY



Fuzzy,

While that is true, if you read MB's blog you will see that the whole thing is bad  procedure.  And if he had to unload it, it is just more 'futzing' with it which will add to the problem.
All tipoes and misspelings are copi-righted.  Pleeze do not reuse without ritten persimmons  :D

DDMac

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Re: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight
« Reply #23 on: March 28, 2008, 05:23:06 PM »
Seems logical that if one (pilot) is trained and duly authorized, you load at home, carry, concealed, until you get home. That is Homeland Security.
Mac.
Standing up for your Right to lay down suppressive fire since 1948!

tombogan03884

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Re: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight
« Reply #24 on: March 28, 2008, 05:32:46 PM »
Fuzzy,

While that is true, if you read MB's blog you will see that the whole thing is bad  procedure.  And if he had to unload it, it is just more 'futzing' with it which will add to the problem.


Seems logical that if one (pilot) is trained and duly authorized, you load at home, carry, concealed, until you get home. That is Homeland Security.
Mac.

Yes, MB goes into quite a bit of detail on his blog about the stupidity of the TSA standards. He also points out that as TSA has always opposed the armed pilot program, it seems like their regulations were designed to CAUSE this type of incident.

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Re: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight
« Reply #25 on: Today at 12:47:27 PM »

MikeO

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Re: Pilot's gun discharges on US Airways flight
« Reply #25 on: May 21, 2008, 11:14:42 AM »
For those who missed it:

Pittsburgh pilot fired over gun incident on US Airways flight

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08109/874569-100.stm

What got him fired was a flying rules violation: not supposed to be doing anything to distract from flying the plane under 10,000 ft. He was handling the weapon at 8,000 ft during the approach for landing. He could have been fired for doing that even w/o the ND.

AKA as the sterile cockpit rule:

U.S. FAR 121.542/135.100, "Flight Crewmember Duties":

(a) No certificate holder shall require, nor may any flight crewmember perform, any duties during a critical phase of flight except those duties required for the safe operation of the aircraft. Duties such as company required calls made for such nonsafety related purposes as ordering galley supplies and confirming passenger connections, announcements made to passengers promoting the air carrier or pointing out sights of interest, and filling out company payroll and related records are not required for the safe operation of the aircraft.

(b) No flight crewmember may engage in, nor may any pilot in command permit, any activity during a critical phase of flight which could distract any flight crewmember from the performance of his or her duties or which could interfere in any way with the proper conduct of those duties. Activities such as eating meals, engaging in nonessential conversations within the cockpit and nonessential communications between the cabin and cockpit crews, and reading publications not related to the proper conduct of the flight are not required for the safe operation of the aircraft.

(c) For the purposes of this section, critical phases of flight includes all ground operations involving taxi, takeoff and landing, and all other flight operations conducted below 10,000 feet, except cruise flight.

Fired for just the ND? Probably not. Fired for just the weapon handling? Probably not. Put 'em together and he's gone.

No matter what the carry rules are, shoulda waited until the plane was safely down, and stopped before handling the weapon in any way. He was in a hurry, he messed up, and that's what got him fired.

The real issue from the beginning was pilot error in handling the weapon at all when he was not supposed to. The lousy procedures, holster/lock combo, ND, etc just made it more interesting and distracted just about everybody.

 

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