Bump and Rob episode

[JAFO]

My wife and I look forward to The Best Defense each week.  She's not that enthusiastic about shooting and is not a CHL holder, but she enjoys watching the Wednesday night shows with me, and TBD is her favorite.  It presents her with good useful information on awareness and avoidance.  So please keep the good info coming!   

In watching the Bump and Rob episode last night, there was one thing that really bothered me.  It was in the segment discussing the scenario of increased awareness allowing the victim to see the aggressor's draw motion and thereby foul the draw and respond with strikes, distance, and possibly his own firearm.  I couldn't help but think that if I was in a legitimate fender bender under similar conditions (at night, empty street), someone who had seen this segment could mistake me for an aggressor when I accessed my cell phone.  I carry strongside, and my cell phone sits on the left at ~8 o'clock on my belt, right where a lefty might carry a weapon.  As I would have a cover garment, I would have to reach up under it to get the phone - an action Mike S pointed out as being a draw signal.

The discussion of the scenario was that if you see someone going up under a garment for something on the belt, immediately move to foul the hands, strike, and possibly access and use a firearm in response.  I've thankfully only been in a few accidents, but I was pretty upset in each one, so I might be pretty agitated or rattled when going to make that 911 call.  In watching the live fire drill, I don't know if I could stop someone who mistakenly thought I meant them harm from attacking me (or possibly shooting me) if they were following that progression.  Even if I wanted to say, "Hey, wait!  Just a phone!", that thought would be out of my head pretty fast once they started pounding on my face, and my instinctive reaction would be to fight back.  And that's not going to do much to de-escalate the situation.

I know I'm not alone in carrying my phone on my belt, so I don't think it's totally out of the realm of possibility for this mistake to occur.  I just would have liked to hear more discussion about needing more than just that furtive motion before going into a defensive response.  Whether it be an "off" feeling, the other person acting very nervious, actually seeing a gun, etc.  I realize any moment spent considering could be a moment lost in a situation where seconds count, but I'd hate to be the recipient of several high velocity projectiles because I was pissed about an accident and trying to call the police.   

[Ranger Dave]

I watched last nights show and the thing I took away from the scenarios was to turn on my hazard lights, motion for the other vehicle to follow and go to a well lighted and poulated area. I would also be on the cell phone to local law enforcement advising of the accident location and where I was going to and have law enforcement meet there.

Ranger Dave

[Solus]

I watched last nights show and the thing I took away from the scenarios was to turn on my hazard lights, motion for the other vehicle to follow and go to a well lighted and poulated area. I would also be on the cell phone to local law enforcement advising of the accident location and where I was going to and have law enforcement meet there.

Ranger Dave

That sounds like the wise thing to do....but it might also be illegal.  Some localities have laws against leaving the scene of an accident and they might be heavy handedly enforced.

[Ranger Dave]

That is why I would be contacting LE to meet somewhere or wait in vehicle till LE shows up. However there are times in Tulsa OK the TPD will operate under "Operation Slick Streets" where TPD will not respond to a non- injury or non-property damage accidents TPD tells motorist to go to the closest QuickTrip(convience store) to fill out an accident form. I know this will vary to each jurisdiction it might be worth checking in your area.

Ranger Dave

[MikeBjerum]

I have had a few horrible days running here.  Even when I've had the TV on I haven't been paying real close attention, but I still manage to come up with a question:

I did not notice or hear, and I may have missed it, anything about a flashlight (torch for the dudes with backwards toilets).  If you didn't mention flashlights, why not?  From sundown to sunup my light is always in my hand when I'm out and about.  At the first note that the other guy was getting close the light in the eyes will buy you the time to break contact many times.

Like I said, if I missed it I am sorry.

[Sponsor]

[Michael Janich]

Thanks, gentlemen, for the great feedback and for your continued support of the show.

One of the greatest challenges we face is trying to pack as much useful information as possible into the 19 minutes we have available (including credits). Typically what ends up happening is that we have to choose a topical threat scenario, a major teaching point as far as physical skill, and a major teaching point with regard to awareness and avoidance. In the case of the bump and rob, the physical skill was the empty-hand-vs.-gun tactic. The avoidance was the idea of driving to a safer area to assess the situation. Within the time limits we had available, I feel we covered them well.

With regard to a cell phone draw being mistaken for a weapon draw, although it's possible, I feel it can be easily avoided. In the natural course of the conversation with the other party, simply say "I'm going to call the police" before reaching for your phone.

If you recorded the episode or look at the preview again, you'll notice that I look around before I go for the gun. That is a pre-incident indicator and a major hint that something bad is about to happen. That type of behavior is what good guys need to look for and will typically not occur if someone is innocently going for his cell phone.

As for the flashlight, yes, I carry one everywhere I go. Would it be a useful addition to that scenario? You bet. Am I a happier guy when I have a thump-tastic chunk of aluminum in my hand and the ability to blind a potential attacker with it before hitting him? Oh, yeah. Could we fit that AND the empty-hand-vs.gun stuff into 19 minutes. Nope.

I covered some flashlight stuff in seasons 2 and 3, so we didn't do any this season. If we get a season 5, however, Seeklander and I want to cover lights and low-light tactics much more thoroughly.

Thanks again for watching, for your feedback, and for understanding the limitations of the format we have to work with.

Stay safe,

Mike

[Michael Bane]

I think Mike J. did a good job of covering the points. Over the years I have become much more of a "talky" person than I used to be.  I started my talky phase after pondering how to deal with law enforcement. As I recently outlined on the podcast, I went through a traffic stop a few months back. I talked my way through everything: "My registration is in the glove compartment...if it's olay with you, officer, I'm going to reach over with my right hand, open the glove box, and remove the registration..." I went through this because I was armed (which comes up on the police computers), had a car full of guns and wanted NO MISTAKES.

My thinking is that we should probably carry that talkiness into the things that happen on a regular day. In the bumper thumper example, if I am going to reach for my phone, perhaps it makes sense to say, "I'm going to get my phone and call the police."

I think a portion of enhanced awareness is making sure our own actions are unambiguous.

Michael B