What does Timothy think of this ?

[Magoo541]

A mentor of mine worked on water jet cutting systems up in the Seattle area and told me about a tracking system that used satellite photos/video and water displacement to visually track subs back in the 80s.  So it is hard for me to believe that no one knew they were here.  Granted they may have known and are just keeping their mouths shut,as mentioned before, which I think is much more likely than a Rusky sub going unnoticed into our costal waters.

[rojawe]

AS bad as this Russia want's no part of our problems under obama and crew they just watch and laugh at the idiot in charge Vote him out

[santahog]

While we're on the subject..
What do we think will happen to the oil platforms in the Gulf if we get crossed up with China, or anybody else with a sub, for that matter?..
Been an irritant of mine for years.. Probably the first time I've mentioned it.. 

[Timothy]

While we're on the subject..
What do we think will happen to the oil platforms in the Gulf if we get crossed up with China, or anybody else with a sub, for that matter?..
Been an irritant of mine for years.. Probably the first time I've mentioned it.. 

SH...we're making an assumption that this Ivan made it into the gulf without detection.  I have first hand knowledge of the capabilities of our oceanographic resources in the Atlantic and Pacific oceans.  The detection of submarine activity in our worlds oceans was my life for my time in the military.

The more I think of this, the more I believe that this sub was not alone.  If this boat captain had done anything untoward regarding our oil resources, I have little doubt that he'd never be heard from again.  The Gulf, at it's deepest point is in excess of 13,000 feet!  The average depth is 1300 meters.  You can hide a great deal of wreckage in that depth and no one would be the wiser.  The Soviets knew in the 70's that they couldn't leave Murmansk or Petropovlosk without us knowing!  Nothing recently has changed my opinion on that...

The Chinese are building diesel boats!  On battery, they're what we sonar geeks call a "black hole"!  When submerged on battery power, they're slow (less than 5-10 knots) but virtually undetectable.  They are a far greater threat to the coast on the Pacific but they'd have a long, long trip to round Cape Horn or come from the east past Capetown.  Either way, they have to charge their batteries and when they do, they make a great deal of noise.

[tombogan03884]

What Tim says about diesel boats however they are limited by how much fuel they can carry.
That's why the German U Boats in American harbors and along our coasts were not more effective.
For a surprisingly good comparison of diesel versus nuke capabilities watch the Kelsey Grammar movie "Down Periscope".

[Sponsor]

[Timothy]

Refueling boats can be disguised as anything.  A few years ago, a Chinese diesel boat popped up in the middle of the USS Kitty Hawk battle group, a long ways from the Asian continent.  Toms point is valid in that it would be very difficult for a diesel boat to travel that far but, all of our WWII boats were diesels and they performed admirably in the Pacific campaigns.

[Solus]

Subs might not have to make noise or even move to be detected.

Not sure how magnetometers have been developed lately, but is seemed promising some time ago.

Don't know if enough of a modern sub can be made of non-ferrous material to avoid detection using that method either.

[tombogan03884]

Magnetometer is one of the sensors used for airborne sub hunting.
Satellites are capable of photographing submerged boats at 300 ft or more.

Refueling is the weak point for diesel boats. The U Boat force had it's back broken by "Hunter Killer" groups that usually consisted of a "Jeep" or "Escort" carrier, about 1/3 the size of a Fleet carrier carrying about one squadron, accompanied by a small escort group of  destroyers, and maybe a Light Cruiser configured for anti submarine warfare.
The basic concept was to send the group to an area based on intercepted German radio messages then conduct an air search the aircraft would locate the sub, and it's supply ship then attack while also directing surface units to the exact location.
With today's technologies of satellites and long endurance drones the job gets even easier.
Where the diesels really shine is in shallower, more confined coastal waters where endurance is less of an issue, for example the Chinese boats would be perfect for interdicting Taiwan, and the Iranian boats are exactly what would be needed for shutting the Gulf of Hormuz and operating in the Arabian sea.

[TAB]

My $.02 this artical is bs.   could a sub sneak in to the gulf?  Yes, could it sneak all the way there with out be detected? not likly.    I did many a sub escort in my time in the coasties, even the smallest of subs are huge the missle subs are just down right scarry big.

[alfsauve]

I would think one cold build a "mother" ship which could hide the sub inside.  Then the sub could be transported close to it's target area and released, batteries fully charged, full load of diesel.   A lot of subterfuge would have to be made about the mother ship, disguised as say a container ship, but if I where China it might be worth a shot.   Even if it didn't work well, it's worth the diversion of US assets.