Bombings vs Shootings take your pick

[Ksail101]

A very quick and crude search showed in 2002 in Isreal, somewhere that used to have good laws that have been stripped and amended to the point that nearly all gun owners own a gun illegally cause they have not renewed liscenses, there were 47 suicide bombings in one year committed by Palistinians.

I know I know. Totally different right?  Well to get a gun in Isreal they have made it very difficult. Where bombs and bomb making components are very easy to collect. Also the result is much more devasting. So lets say we ban guns here or regulate them to the point that American gun owners are forced to be criminals under ridiculous legislation and loops and hoops to be a legal gun owner. Thus basically giving all rights away cause police could enter your house under probable cause for the receipt of a gun purchase somewhere in your past. So in a place where teachers carry guns openly in class and school shootings don't happen and most of the county own and carry guns illegally we have a sect of people who have morphed, mutated, done the evolution thing and adapted to suicide bombings with devasating affect.

So all these people who think this will stop if we ban guns. Think again it will continue on with something else. I just don't think giving away my rights and setting America up for its first dictator state with no threat of citizens taking the country back cause they are Armed and every other  reason I could sit here and pour out on why giving away rights are bad not the least of which when you do you spit on the grave of every soldier that has died protecting those freedoms and slapped the face of every living veteran is a good idea or going to stop horrible crimes.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/middle-east/israel-and-palestine/121217/gun-control-sandy-hook-shooting-israel-lanza

[Frosty]

The wheels are in motion to get the "Assault weapons" ban going again. What does it do? Absolutely nada! You can't buy a gun/rifle that looks like an "assault gun" (How I hate that term) , they limit the size of the mag, BFD. I believe there are 2,500 (or more) gun laws on the books. What have they done? NADA! The feds can make all the rules they want regarding gun control and they do squat other than waste our money on the bickering they do on "the HILL" in the District of Corruption. The Feds are the worst offenders (operation fast & furious). I have attended classes regarding bombs, IEDS, Vehicle bombs, improvised manufacturing of explosives & suicide bombers. The day is all ready here that the crazies will use bombs, plain & simple. The nut case in the theater shootings had his apt. rigged with explosives prior to his shooting spree. The general public hasn't a clue what goes on out there that doesn't make "the evening news" As an unknown Marine in Iraq said "Americas not at war, the Marines are at war, Americas at the mall shopping"We as American's must not let our Constitutional rights be eroded any more and remember The 2nd Amendment is there for when they try to take it from us.

[Frosty]

A very quick and crude search showed in 2002 in Isreal, somewhere that used to have good laws that have been stripped and amended to the point that nearly all gun owners own a gun illegally cause they have not renewed liscenses, there were 47 suicide bombings in one year committed by Palistinians.

I know I know. Totally different right?  Well to get a gun in Isreal they have made it very difficult. Where bombs and bomb making components are very easy to collect. Also the result is much more devasting. So lets say we ban guns here or regulate them to the point that American gun owners are forced to be criminals under ridiculous legislation and loops and hoops to be a legal gun owner. Thus basically giving all rights away cause police could enter your house under probable cause for the receipt of a gun purchase somewhere in your past. So in a place where teachers carry guns openly in class and school shootings don't happen and most of the county own and carry guns illegally we have a sect of people who have morphed, mutated, done the evolution thing and adapted to suicide bombings with devasating affect.

So all these people who think this will stop if we ban guns. Think again it will continue on with something else. I just don't think giving away my rights and setting America up for its first dictator state with no threat of citizens taking the country back cause they are Armed and every other  reason I could sit here and pour out on why giving away rights are bad not the least of which when you do you spit on the grave of every soldier that has died protecting those freedoms and slapped the face of every living veteran is a good idea or going to stop horrible crimes.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/middle-east/israel-and-palestine/121217/gun-control-sandy-hook-shooting-israel-lanza

If you click on the above address be sure to go to Case studies? Australia, Scotland changed laws after mass shootings in the right hand column. They have a poll regarding gun control - go to it & vote.

[Ksail101]

Frosty I agree with you an AWB at this point is completely pointless. There are so many ARs and Aks out there that it doesn't matter. You can't even buy Glock  magazines. So the Anti gunners that blame these are at the most fault then. They should be blaming themselves. But the truth is they know deep down that the guns are not the issue but have a certain agenda solely for AWB. What ever it is. It scares them or they want to socialist Europeans or they know if they can get one class of guns then they can get them all ar some point. But letting the ban sunset is their problem. Cause now the cat is out of the bag. Anyone that wants one has one. And you know what, anytime I have gotten a gun it doesn't matter the time or stituation it gets held my SSN must be close to someone else's that is bad. But this idea that anyone can go buy a gun is ridiculous. Sure anyone can get only illegally ie stealing one from their mother.


Speaking of mothers. I sometimes feel mothers get blamed too much for their grown kids doing something stupid. But in this situation the mother took her son shooting and told a friend she has to take him cause she doesn't trust him to be alone cause there is something odd about him. A responsible gun owner would have taken steps to not allow firearms in to his hands. I'm sorry I don't go shooting with just anyone at anytime. I have even left gun ranges when I see peol coming in renting guns who I don't feel comfortable around. Actually just did it a couple weeks ago. The lady next to me was acting a fool and I just left. I told the guy at the counter he better watch her and left.

[Frosty]

Yea, I've left the range a couple of times when the yahoo's arrive that I believe are sh*t stupid, I have told the range master to keep his eye on them as I exit the range.
A year ago I was working part time doing armed security for 3 yrs. When I was going thru the companies training to be armed, there were two guys that were in the training class and after 10mins. I said to myself these 2 are loose nuts behind the wheel, not more than 6 mos. later one of those cowboys was on duty and practicing his quick draw in an elevator. Well, he shot the elevator with his .45, just wounded it but none the less he had sh*t for brains. I don't know what the answer is to keep weapons out of the hands of sh*t  stupid people. They live among us & give the rest of us a bad rap - so watch your back, keep fighting the good fight and stay safe.

[Sponsor]

[tombogan03884]

We are talking about 2 totally different things here.
The sh!t stupid person with a gun may injure some one, or himself.
They are not the issue, they are like death and taxes, they will always be with us, try to stay clear of them as much as possible and get over it.
The real issue is that in every one of these mass attacks the killer has been known to be dangerously unstable but nothing constructive has been done about it .
State mental hospitals used to house these sort of people, but the very same liberals who are screaming to ban guns said that it violated their rights to "warehouse them" that way. (The left is great with catchy phrases to identify a problem, it's just their "solutions" that suck)
What about the rights of the rest of us ?
Where does it say that a known public danger has the right to walk the streets ?

[tt11758]

Here's an idea I floated on facebook a little while ago:

Since we seem to be in a mood to ban things, how about we ban something that might actually help to prevent tragedies like that in Connecticut?

Let's ban the media from publishing or broadcasting the names of the perpetrators in these types of crimes, therefore taking away the notoriety borne of infamy that forever keeps their names in the public consciousness. After all, if someone feels like a worthless nobody who wants to take their own life, but also wants to "be somebody famous" by running up a big body count, banning the release of their name would defeat their purpose.

Think about it, we all remember the names Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, but how many of us remember the names of even one of their victims.........you know, the people who deserve the recognition? We remember the name James Holmes, but do we remember any of the victims of his rampage in that Colorado theater? Or Jared Laughner. I'm willing to bet that the only victim name we remember from that incident is Gabby Giffords.

My rather long-winded point is simply this, if we deprive potential shooters of the notoriety they crave from their dastardly deeds, perhaps we can remove the incentive to commit them.

Just sayin..................

Thoughts?

[tt11758]

One more thing.  THe following article proves that guns aren't necessary to create mass casualties in American schools.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/crime.html

The recent shootings in Newtown, Conn., have led many people to characterize school violence as a modern affliction, a byproduct of our national obsession with guns and media violence. But the deadliest school-related massacre in American history happened in 1927, at an elementary school in Bath, Mich. A school board member named Andrew Kehoe, upset over a burdensome property tax, wired the building with dynamite and set it off in the morning of May 18. Kehoe’s actions killed 45 people, 38 of whom were children.

At the time, Bath was a small farm community with under 300 residents. The town had “an elevator, a little drugstore, and you knew everybody within 20 miles,” as one survivor of the attack recalled in 2009. Perhaps its most modern feature was the Bath Consolidated School, which opened its doors in 1922 and brought all the region’s students under one roof. In The Bath School Disaster, published in 1927 and available online here, Kehoe’s neighbor, Monty J. Ellsworth, noted that the consolidated school was markedly superior to the “common country school” that preceded it. It was also more expensive, and the township raised property taxes in order to repay the school’s bonds.

This upset Andrew Kehoe. A local farmer with training as an electrical engineer, he was a severe, stubborn man fond of drastic solutions to small problems; Ellsworth writes that Kehoe once shot a noisy dog and killed his own horse because it was lazy. In an article from May 20, 1927, the New York Times noted that Kehoe “was known through the countryside as a ‘dynamite farmer’.  Neighbors detailed how he was continually setting off blasts on his farm, blowing up stumps and rocks.”

Kehoe really hated taxes, and joined the school board to argue against them. The Times reported that, as a board member, he “appeared to have a tax mania and fought the expenditure or money for the most necessary equipment.” In 1926, he ran for town clerk, but his obstructionist reputation preceded him, and he was defeated. His loss in that race, coupled with the news that his farm was facing foreclosure, appears to have triggered his plan.

Over the course of several months, Kehoe gained access to the school and packed it tight with dynamite that was wired together so expertly that, after the explosion, investigators could hardly believe that Kehoe had acted alone. A few days before the attack, Kehoe visited Monty Ellsworth for a round of target shooting; afterwards, Ellsworth looked inside Kehoe’s vehicle and saw “a box in the back about two feet long and 12 or 14 inches wide which was about half full of rifle shells. I believe there must have been a thousand of them.”

The school exploded at 8:45 a.m. on May 18. At that point, after killing his wife and destroying his farm, Kehoe hopped inside an explosive-laden truck and drove to the school. Thirty minutes after the initial attack, while conversing with the superintendent, he detonated the truck bomb, killing himself, the superintendent, and a few others. Later, investigators found that a short circuit in Kehoe’s wiring was the only thing that stopped the attack from claiming more lives, as “more than 500 pounds of dynamite and several sacks of gunpowder were found under a portion of the building that remained standing.” If the explosion had gone as planned, Bath’s entire downtown might have been destroyed.


The ruins of Andrew Kehoe's house, post-explosions.
Wikimedia Commons
Like the Newtown school shooting, the Bath bombing was a major news story. Ellsworth writes, “I think we had the greatest demonstration of American sympathy ever awarded a grief stricken community. Thousands and thousands of cars stayed in line for hours. I have a gas station one-half mile west of Bath on the main road to Lansing, where there was a double row of traffic all day. In the afternoon it took about four hours to get three miles, but I don't remember … hearing a single horn sounded. It was like a great funeral procession. Everyone's heart was filled with sympathy.”

But the attention was short-lived. In an interview this summer with the Christian Science Monitor, Arnie Bernstein, author of 2009’s Bath Massacre: America’s First School Bombing, noted that “there wasn't a media frenzy like today. The media came in and left. Three days after it happened, Lindbergh took off and flew to Paris, and that part of it was over.”

It took the people of Bath much longer to recover. In 2009, NPR went back to the town and found several survivors of the attack still living. Now in their 90s, the survivors noted that “we still look at ourselves as survivors. So you look after one another differently, because you know that the absolute unthinkable can happen, even going to school.”

An inquest eventually determined that Kehoe had acted alone. Amid the ruins of Kehoe’s farm, they found a sign attached to a fence. It read: “Criminals are made, not born.”

[tombogan03884]

I've posted several comments on the subject of media collusion in these events.
The jist was that on Friday it was news, on Saturday it would have been day old news if there were not wars in Afghanistan, Syria, and the "West Bank, plus a Sec of State getting a concussion.
On days 4,5, and 6 it is nothing but the MSM Propaganda machine cashing in on dead children.

To return to the theme of my last post, "warehousing" the criminally insane, if we had locked away just 3 people,
The guy at Va Tech, the guy in Colo, and this guy in Conn, all of whom were known to be dangerously unstable, it would have saved over 130 lives.

[Ksail101]

Tom I agree with you that was the long winded post I wrote about the death of the serial killer. We are talking about a psychopathic person that can no longer draw out his killings do to science.

But a responsible gun owner would not have done what this mother did. He would not of had access to my firearms and I would not have taken him to a range. That's the argument we were presenting. As gun owners we have taken on a larger responsibility to make good judgements with our firearms for all the obvious reasons and cause we all control the destiny of the gun culture. As bad as that is cause they will lump us all together when crap happens. Just like now.