Quality Is Junk Today

[billt]

Last weekend I replaced both my water softener, and my water heater. The softener was shot. (It was old, and wouldn't recharge automatically any more). The water heater was still OK, but I had to drain it, disconnect it, and move it over in order to accommodate the new softener, which is much wider. So I figured I would replace it as well.

Both the softener and water heater are A.O. Smith. I got a good price on both. I first removed the old water heater, then hooked up the new one. Everything went well, with zero leaks. Then I hooked up the new softener, and the damn thing had a small leak by the bypass valve. It would leak a small puddle about the diameter of a beer can in 8 hours or so. It would drain into the brine tank, not on the floor. So I wasn't too worried.

They had stickers all over it saying not to return it to where you bought it, (Lowe's). But rather to call a number for, "technical support" on the sticker. So I did. The guy is sending me the new part, along with 2 new O-Rings to replace. He even E-Mailed me an installation procedure, with photos showing how to remove the old part, and install the new one. (Apparently this happens so frequently they have a procedure for it).

I can't believe I paid good money for a new water softener, and now have to end up fixing it myself. Quality has sure gone to $h!t. You would think on a brand new unit they would at least send a tech out to fix it. If this turns into a nightmare, I'm going to raise hell.

[Timothy]

Bill,

Manufacturers have been producing appliances and other stuff for the big box stores for years.  It’s the Walmart method of producing cheap stuff for the masses!

Having worked for Lowe’s myself, I’d never buy anything from them like water heaters.

I no longer have to do this kind of repair but I did for decades both at home and at work producing water systems for de-ionization.  I always used an industrial supply house for everything.

[alfsauve]

Only a couple of companies, like A.O. Smith, actually make water heaters.  Unlike electronics, I don't think there's any difference between what they ship to the big box stores and what they ship to the industrial supply stores.  I might even see about getting one on-line, if the shipping is free, next time.

Speaking of water heaters.   Mine is natural gas powered and I forgot to put in a Tee in the gas line to trap water when I installed it.  A couple years back the gas company replaced all the outside lines and meters in my hood.  And before they would turn the gas back on, they inspected all the gas appliances.   I got written up because of the lack of the Tee.   I promised to fix it the next day (I lied) so they turned the gas back on anyway.  Besides it had been that way for over 5 years with no problem. 

I eventually gathered the parts to put in the Tee, but I kept thinking:   I know that "the code" requires a Tee, but what does the manufacturer say?  Why haven't they solved the problem of water in the gas line?   (Does "the code" sound like The Pirates Code, which as we all know are more like guidelines?)   Anyway I go look up the installation instructions for my heater.  GUESS WHAT THEY SAY:  "IF a Tee is required by code then...."  Well that doesn't sound like THEY think it's necessary.  So I call customer support.  Oh, they have been well schooled in this question.  They won't say a Tee is required.  They won't say that a Tee isn't necessary.  They have a stock answer which is their only response.   "IF your local building code requires a Tee..."  "Sir, that is all I'm authorized to tell you."

I decided, considering my heater is over 10 years old, not to bother it.   Put the parts away for the next installation. 

[billt]

I kept hearing much the same thing about expansion tanks for water heaters. Everything from, you're crazy not to have one.... To they're not necessary. I lived in the exact same model, built by the same builder up the hill, back in 1991, and it didn't have an expansion tank. Neither did this house. So I never bothered with it. In fact, I've never lived in a house that ever had one.

I agree with you that there isn't any difference in quality in these units. A given model is manufactured the same, regardless of where it's sold. Think about it. It would be ridiculous to have different quality built into the same model, on the same assembly line. What would they do, announce this next batch is for Home Depot... So start making crap!

[TAB]

Trust me there is a difference, same with plumbing fixtures.


Facets are the worst.  They can have the same part number, nut from the box storea they can be a pound lighter.

Not all do, but there is a difference.

[Sponsor]

[alfsauve]

I kept hearing much the same thing about expansion tanks for water heaters. Everything from, you're crazy not to have one.... To they're not necessary.

Code in the local area required expansion tanks for about 10 years, then they dropped the requirement.  Since I do most of my own plumbing I never put one in.    Their big concern was when the water companies started putting in back-flow preventers at the meter.    They discovered it wasn't the big problem they thought it was going to be.

[billt]

The one thing I like about this new water softener, (A.O. Smith AO-WH 350), is the bypass valve assembly is really a nice and solid one piece molded unit. My old one, (Whirlpool), had a bunch of O-Rings and plastic C-Clips, holding connectors that held the main supply lines to the unit. When I went to remove them, the clips just broke right off without hardly any pressure. I easily pulled the connector out with 2 fingers. (This was under city pressure all the time).

The whole thing was a plumbing disaster just waiting to happen. I'm damn lucky I didn't have a flood. The supply lines on this new one screw right into the bypass valve with no couplers, connectors, or clips. It's a nice, solid, direct threaded connection. Nothing can, "blow out". O-Rings have to be installed carefully. And you have to use a bit of lube, and finesse them into place without forcing them. Or else it's easy to pinch and shear them.

I'm guessing that's what happened to mine. Hopefully when I get this part and new O-Rings, I should be good to go. It doesn't look like too bad of a job. But as we all know, looks can be deceiving. 

[Timothy]

I’m with TAB!

It’s not a mystery that they cheap stuff down!

[Rastus]

<snip> I always used an industrial supply house for everything.

I am coming around to that way of thinking as well.  Better quality products.  And for the electrical, cheaper and better than most of what I have purchased at either Lowes or Home Depot.  One of my contractors likes to buy from Ace Hardware because it's close to him...their prices are horrible.

[TAB]

I am coming around to that way of thinking as well.  Better quality products.  And for the electrical, cheaper and better than most of what I have purchased at either Lowes or Home Depot.  One of my contractors likes to buy from Ace Hardware because it's close to him...their prices are horrible.

  supply houses for electrial, hvac, plumbing, mill work, flooring and roofing.   For what box stores have, they dont have a lot.   I spent way too much in them, but when you look at what i am actually buying, its stuff like drywall, 2x stock, basic hardware amd thats about it.  Yet its still 6 or 7 figures  a year in them.