midway usa commercial on best defense 1000 point scale

[david86440]

You didn't think I would be that foolish?           No, don't answer that.

That's alright then   

[Vapor]

http://www.midwayusa.com/midwayusa/staticpages/charts/CCH_rating_chart.htm

Found this information

[MikeBjerum]

I like the CCW segment...it provides a good initial primer for evaluating guns for a beginner...but he does need to add an item or two (weight, reliability, ease of maintenance).....

Seeker,

You have a good point, but these items are more subjective than even the other items he rates.  Mr. Potterfield's time to first shot, and number of shots on target are only consistent because he is the one doing it the same way for each gun.  As said in many commercials, "Your actual results may vary."

The items you mention are have more variability than what he is testing:

Weight - Just like size in a carry situation is going to be more a matter of size of the person.  I joke because I carry a a full sized 1911 and have no problems.  I will actually put a 5" 1911 on my hip and a j-frame in my pocket, and go unnoticed.  However, there are people out there that can't hide a KelTech or Ruger .380 under a parka without it showing or weighting them off balance;

Reliability - At one point I heard him explain in an interview that it is a given that any of the items he rates is going to be reliable and durable.  He leaves these rankings to the testers that go into that;

Maintenance - This is a personal practice item.  Once you decide to carry and use a gun it is up to you to maintain it.  Once you learn how to do something it is easy.  I can tear down, clean and lube, and reassemble my 1911's so fast it will make your head spin, but I an hardly get the slide off my M&P and XD, because I don't do it that often.  Others can do the "tupperware" blindfolded, but they don't know how to start on a 1911.

All three are good points, but that is where you as a gun owner and user need to evaluate your own preferences.

[ericire12]

Seeker,

You have a good point, but these items are more subjective than even the other items he rates.  Mr. Potterfield's time to first shot, and number of shots on target are only consistent because he is the one doing it the same way for each gun.  As said in many commercials, "Your actual results may vary."

The items you mention are have more variability than what he is testing:

Weight - Just like size in a carry situation is going to be more a matter of size of the person.  I joke because I carry a a full sized 1911 and have no problems.  I will actually put a 5" 1911 on my hip and a j-frame in my pocket, and go unnoticed.  However, there are people out there that can't hide a KelTech or Ruger .380 under a parka without it showing or weighting them off balance;

Reliability - At one point I heard him explain in an interview that it is a given that any of the items he rates is going to be reliable and durable.  He leaves these rankings to the testers that go into that;

Maintenance - This is a personal practice item.  Once you decide to carry and use a gun it is up to you to maintain it.  Once you learn how to do something it is easy.  I can tear down, clean and lube, and reassemble my 1911's so fast it will make your head spin, but I an hardly get the slide off my M&P and XD, because I don't do it that often.  Others can do the "tupperware" blindfolded, but they don't know how to start on a 1911.

All three are good points, but that is where you as a gun owner and user need to evaluate your own preferences.

I would also add concealabilty to the list (some of the full size guns score very high, but are not very practical for concealed carry). I would also like to see "time to first shot" be done from some level of concealment (cover garment) or change the subject from concealed carry gun to defensive gun.

I also believe that the point scale for "time to first hit" is a little iffy and probably should be reevaluated (1.5 seconds spread equals a diff of 400 points?).

I also think points value should be increased for the area of follow up shots. Getting 5 shots on the bad guy is only gonna get you 100 points? Hell, if you can get a single shot .45 on target in 2 seconds you will get a score of 867....... That would take the competition, but there are many a gun out there that I would rather have as a CCW then a single shot .45

[MikeBjerum]

Concealability is what I was getting at along with weight.  Body size has a lot to do with concealability.  When it comes to drawing from concealment, or drawing in general, I am better off with IWB or a high mounted belt holster and a larger gun.  Small guns and anything inside a pocket is best compared to a monkey trying to get a coconut out of a knothole.

Did anyone see MJ last night with his IWB?  I think he needs to double his waist measurement when he is carrying IWB!  Put a jacket over that, and there will still be a lump.  I wear a colored t-shirt untucked and my Gov. model 1911 IWB, and no one notices. 

Call me full figured if you want, but I will also be fully armed 

[Sponsor]

[seeker_two]

Seeker,

You have a good point, but these items are more subjective than even the other items he rates. 

I'd disagree with that.....there are some objective numbers to each of these...

WEIGHT: Weight is a significant factor in CCW, esp. for a beginner who hasn't discovered the right belt/holster combo or is using pocket carry. Even MB has remarked on how the "professionals" leave the 38+oz. 1911 at home and carry the Airweight snubbies. And weight doesn't necessarily equal size....I have a small 9mm (Firestar M43) that weighs as much as a full-sized Beretta 92. Conversely, more weight also makes most guns easier to shoot. A 30oz. .40S&W is much easier to shoot than a 20oz. .40S&W. 

RELIABILITY:  Easy...how many stoppages per 50-100rds?  But I'm glad to hear that Mr. Potterfield is screening that before any other testing.

MAINTENANCE:  How easy is the firearm to clean? To disassemble (if needed)?  To adjust the sights (if necessary)?  Most importantly, how easy is it to teach a newcommer to do these things?  I'd rank the Glock, XD, and Beretta 92 higher than a 1911 or BHP in this regard....but I'd rank DA revolvers even higher (no regular disassembly required).

[MikeBjerum]

seeker,

I am going to leave this debate, because right, wrong or otherwise, we are 180 degrees apart on these issues and you are bringing in more areas that I disagree with (sights - my carry guns are non adjustable, because I am not going to rely on little tiny screws in a daily carry situation).

Look forward to butting heads in the future.

Mike

[seeker_two]

Me too.  Thanks, Mike!

[ericire12]

Anyone else notice that Potterfield has now really focused in on guns specifically designed for concealed carry during this season's best defense survival? Looks like he got the message (They also have been giving him grief on other forums about it too).