Inconsistency of Air Travel with Firearms.....

[r_w]

I am SOOO glad my job changed and I don't have to fly anymore.

[tt11758]

Sounds like it might be time for Rob to get his private pilot's license.

[fightingquaker13]

In theory, you show up with a lockable metal case with unloaded guns. You can have up to 11 pounds of commericially loaded ammo in its original box(es) in a separate piece of luggage. If you are carrying a pistol, you can have a small metal case inside a larger piece of luggae, but that luggage still can't contain ammo.

.....

-RJP

Does the case have to be metal? I've flown with plastic in the past with no problem, but that was pre-911. I'm thinking of visiting a cousin in Alaska and want to know if I need to be on the look out for a used metal case.
FQ13

[1776 Rebel]

I've heard that Boston, NYC and Chicago (maybe others) have decided that you CANNOT have firearms at the airport even if you are legally transporting them through those cities from and to legal spots. This could become an issue if you got bumped from a connection in Chicago, for example, and had to spend the night. When you go back the next morning to check in your guns, you are in violation of law. Don't know if it has happened yet....YMMV.

PLEASE BE ADVISED ! YOU RISK IMMEDIATE ARREST IF FLYING THRU NY AIRPORTS AND YOU DON'T HAVE A VALID NYS PISTOL PERMIT !!!

The following is from the New York State Rifle & Pistol Assoc website "Warning about airports" link. http://www.nysrpa.org/ Warning about traveling through New York airports

From NRA:

The District Attorney in Albany County and Queens 18 months ago issued an order to arrest anyone coming through the airports with a handgun in their luggage, regardless if the handgun was being transported properly by FAA regulations. The criteria is if you do not have a NY license, you are charged. So what's happening is 2 different scenarios:

1. People are flying into New York from other states, most but not all of whom have carry permits from their home states, and are carrying a pistol. When they go to fly home, they declare the gun, which has always been unloaded and locked up properly in their checked luggage, but if they cannot produce a NY license, they are promptly charged with illegal weapon possession, and their gun confiscated forever. (The Albany airport sheriff has been doing it as a lower class misdemeanor, the LaGuardia cases were charged as a felony.) As their home state permit is not reciprocal, and they were in NY state for an amount of time carrying a handgun, this group is screwed.

2. People are DRIVING to the airport from another state where the NY airport is their closest one to fly out of, and are getting popped right off the bat an hour or two from their home. In these cases, we are going to war for them being covered by FOPA, even the Sheriff's office and TSA in Albany have argued over that with the DA, but he won't budge. He did, however, blink on the two cases from Albany, with the people getting a walk. Didn't get their guns back, though, either time.

Bottom line, UNLESS you are in possession of a VALID New York pistol license, DO NOT bring a handgun in your luggage to the airport, you will be charged.

This is not being done in any other state in the country except at Logan international in Boston, (same thing there) but even at O'Hare in Illinois, if you come in from another state and meet FAA guidelines, they feel you are covered by FOPA and off you go a happy camper.

Reminder to Travelers of Requirements for Transporting Firearms, Firearm Parts and Ammunition on Commercial Aircraft


Passengers are prohibited from carrying firearms, firearm parts and ammunition. Federal regulations administered by the Transportation Security Administration (TSA) prohibit the carriage of firearms and guns, as well as parts of firearms and guns (such as magazines or clips, bolts, firing pins, and other components), in the traveler's possession or in carry-on luggage on commercial aircraft. Ammunition also is NOT allowed as a carry-on item. Carrying even a single round of ammunition through airport security checkpoints is a violation of regulations. TSA regulations are strictly enforced. Violations can result in criminal prosecution and imposition of civil penalties of up to 10.000 per violation.


Checked baggage requirements for transporting firearms and ammunition. All persons carrying firearms and ammunition in checked baggage, including Law Enforcement Officers, must comply with the provisions of 49 CFR § 1540.111. Following is a summary of key requirements of this section and other regulatory provisions.

All firearms must be declared to the air carrier during the ticket counter check-in process. Travelers with firearms should check-in at the ticket counter and not use electronic check-in (e.g., kiosks or the Internet).

All declared firearms must be unloaded and transported in a locked hard-sided container. Travelers are advised to place all firearm parts in a locked hard-sided container to avoid violations.

Access to the declared firearm must be restricted, with only the passenger possessing the container combination or key to the lock. In the event TSA must open the container for inspection, it is preferred that the passenger turn over the key or combination to the screener.

Any ammunition transported must be placed in checked baggage and securely packed in fiber (such as cardboard), wood or metal boxes or other packaging specifically designed to carry small amounts of ammunition. firearm magazines/clips do not satisfy the packaging requirement unless they provide a complete and secure enclosure of the ammunition (e.g., by securely covering the exposed portions of the magazine or by securely placing the magazine in a pouch, holder, holster or lanyard). The ammunition may also be located in the same hard-sided case as the firearm as long as it is properly packed as described here.

It is also recommended that the ammunition package in checked baggage be stabilized, either by tapping it to the interior wall of the bag, or by use of packing material or other means to ensure the ammunition package does not move about the interior of the bag during transportation.

Black powder, including Pyrodex, and percussion caps used with black-powder type firearms are not permitted on board aircraft, either as accessible property or in checked baggage.



Travelers should also contact their air carrier before arrival for check-in regarding its firearm and ammunition policies.

Additional information about the carriage of firearms, firearm parts and ammunition, as well as other air travel tips, can be found at www.tsa.gov or by contacting the TSA Contact Center toll-free at 1-866-289-9673 or by email at TSA-ContactCenter@dhs.gov

DIRECT CONTACT/S:
Jerry Henderson, Federal Security Director, 501-372-8376
Charles "Chuck" Polk, Stakeholder Manager, 501-912-6028

Letter from Department of Justice to Congressman Donald Young on this issue.


 

[DonWorsham]

  Did I miss something, or is that just a practice you do in order to avoid issues with the airlines?  When travel to states where I can CCW, I use a small case that has the handgun, a box of 20 rounds, two magazines all together in a locked metal case. 

Yes and no. I traveled with a TSA approved plastic container for I don't know how many flights. The container is placed inside my regular luggage. Never a peep from anyone. Then the last time I flew, the TSA guy says open it up. I have a loaded mag in the gun. He says "well you just need to put the mag down into your luggage and only the gun in the container. So I do and off I go. I didn't volunteer there was one in the pipe! I will indeed ensure I know the current policies of both the TSA and the airline next time I fly...and follow those polices.

[Sponsor]

[Hazcat]

I think it was on this forum some where that an announcement from TSA cleared that up.

As I remember, empty gun but rounds in same case was OK.

[DonWorsham]

From TSA...

You must securely pack any ammunition in fiber (such as cardboard), wood or metal boxes or other packaging that is specifically designed to carry small amounts of ammunition.

You can't use firearm magazines/clips for packing ammunition unless they completely and securely enclose the ammunition (e.g., by securely covering the exposed portions of the magazine or by securely placing the magazine in a pouch, holder, holster or lanyard).

You may carry the ammunition in the same hard-sided case as the firearm, as long as you pack it as described above.

[Rob Pincus]

So today, TSA at Houston told me that I couldn't fly with a metal case that I've been traveling with for over a decade. I had to buy an "approved" case with metal edges, but 90% plastic surface in order to fly to ohio with my limit of 5 guns. $85 for the crappy case and $100 for the "extra" piece of luggage.

Unreal.

-RJP

[MikeBjerum]

I've never had an issue with TSA.  I have even found out that those guys have a sense of humor.  The only time I saw anything out of TSA was when a counter agent sent me over with my guns by myself - The counter agent is supposed to escort you, and in some airports actually carry the gun case.

TSA has the ammo pounds rule.  However, Minneapolis puts a limit on the number of rounds that is exactly half the weight (in .45 acp).  I found out they don't like it when you take the surplus back out to the pick up in the ramp.

I have always understood the five gun rule, but the last time I flew I took four in one case.  It was no problem in Minneapolis, and it was no problem at the counter in Phoenix.  However, while sitting and waiting to board, with my Kalispel case on the tarmac, the XYZ airline "gun guy" called me up over the PA and made a big deal about five guns in one case (I bought one in AZ).  He claimed that it is max of five with no more than two in each case.  When I asked how I was supposed to get them back home, and he learned that I had flown down there that way, he explained that he WAS the "gun guy" and he would bend the rule, but don't ever try it again.  By this time everyone on the plane knows that I am some redneck son of a bitch and wondering what kind of arsenal I have in the cargo hold.  Way to keep the public calm dude!

[Timothy]

"By this time everyone on the plane knows thinks that I am some redneck son of a bitch and wondering what kind of arsenal I have in the cargo hold."

Some of us don't have a problem with that Mike!