felons and background checks...

[TAB]

I was reading a thread on another site, where a guy was strongly against felons having guns and back ground checks...

Now I'm pretty sure that every one here agrees that violent felons should not be able to own guns.( I know a few people might not...)

We also know that felons can get guns illegally.


Anyways, Other then a back ground check, how could you stop a felon from walking into a gun store and buying a gun?


Logicly, the only way you could keep  a segment of the population from owning a gun( legally) is to have a back ground check.

Note you could replace gun with anything else...



PS , yes I am fully aware that back ground checks are a new thing...

[fightingquaker13]

I agree. The greatest threat to our gun rights is the criminal. Everytime someone uses one in a crime, its another reason to punish the rest of us. If criminals couldn't get guns, I wouldn't carry one. Th difference between me and the antis is that I am smart enough to realize that criminals are, you know, criminals, and unlikely to obey gun control laws. Even though the 443 is a joke (how many people answer, yes I am a fugitve), the quicky phone call to check for warrants and convictions isn't. It rarely takes more than a few minutes and seems harmless and a detterent to a criminal getting a gun directly from a licensed dealer. As long as they don't keep the records, who cares. Although, realitically, if the feds wanted to know who had guns all they'd need to do is suppeana a dealers "bound book" regardless of the background check.
FQ13

[TAB]

I agree. The greatest threat to our gun rights is the criminal. Everytime someone uses one in a crime, its another reason to punish the rest of us. If criminals couldn't get guns, I wouldn't carry one. Th difference between me and the antis is that I am smart enough to realize that criminals are, you know, criminals, and unlikely to obey gun control laws. Even though the 443 is a joke (how many people answer, yes I am a fugitve), the quicky phone call to check for warrants and convictions isn't. It rarely takes more than a few minutes and seems harmless and a detterent to a criminal getting a gun directly from a licensed dealer. As long as they don't keep the records, who cares. Although, realitically, if the feds wanted to know who had guns all they'd need to do is suppeana a dealers "bound book" regardless of the background check.
FQ13

working for a FFL, never had anyone say yes to that, but atleast once a month some one answered yes to the drug/ booze q.  They would get so pissed when we would not sell them a gun.  same with people that were drunk and high.

[True_Texan]

To be honest, the questions on the forms are a joke. I can fill out one in less then a minute, accurate, truthful and complete; blindfolded, with fingers in my ears using my foot to write.

There is no reason for any self respecting (smart) criminal to answer truthfully to the questions. For me though, because I have a CHL, there is no phone call required for the purchase. If I have jumped through all the hoops required for that, I am good to go. Which is really how it should be. The local and federal law enforcement offices have more information on/about me then they do the average Joe Blow gang banger criminal.

IMHO, what it will take is more accurate and faster accessible criminal records for those running the background check. So instead of keeping track of what someone didn't do, they need to have accountings for what people have done. This should be a fairly easy task considering the age of technology and the speed at which information travels on the Internet.

No matter what is done with it, there will always be flaws in the system. For example, I went to renew my drivers license. I get to the front of the line and start talking with a lady who has literally known me my entire life. She looks at the computer and it shows I am an not a US citizen (AKA. illegal alien) Some one entering information forgot to check the correct box. To fix this, I had to go home, get my birth certificate and return to the TX DPS office. It was an inconvenience but overall not a huge problem to fix. So more accurate, but occasionally flawed back ground checks would be a decent compromise overall. Yes there will be law abiding people that run into incorrect information that will need to be fixed, but criminals will give up easily with obtaining a 'legal' firearm and just get one the way the rest of the underworld will. Buying it from a guy in an overcoat, standing on the sidewalk... That or they get flashed by a pervert. 

[TAB]

To be honest, the questions on the forms are a joke. I can fill out one in less then a minute, accurate, truthful and complete; blindfolded, with fingers in my ears using my foot to write.

There is no reason for any self respecting (smart) criminal to answer truthfully to the questions. For me though, because I have a CHL, there is no phone call required for the purchase. If I have jumped through all the hoops required for that, I am good to go. Which is really how it should be. The local and federal law enforcement offices have more information on/about me then they do the average Joe Blow gang banger criminal.

IMHO, what it will take is more accurate and faster accessible criminal records for those running the background check. So instead of keeping track of what someone didn't do, they need to have accountings for what people have done. This should be a fairly easy task considering the age of technology and the speed at which information travels on the Internet.

No matter what is done with it, there will always be flaws in the system. For example, I went to renew my drivers license. I get to the front of the line and start talking with a lady who has literally known me my entire life. She looks at the computer and it shows I am an not a US citizen (AKA. illegal alien) Some one entering information forgot to check the correct box. To fix this, I had to go home, get my birth certificate and return to the TX DPS office. It was an inconvenience but overall not a huge problem to fix. So more accurate, but occasionally flawed back ground checks would be a decent compromise overall. Yes there will be law abiding people that run into incorrect information that will need to be fixed, but criminals will give up easily with obtaining a 'legal' firearm and just get one the way the rest of the underworld will. Buying it from a guy in an overcoat, standing on the sidewalk... That or they get flashed by a pervert. 

I'm not sure yu understand how the the NCIS check works.  its just a list of people that can not own guns, if your on the list, you can't buy a gun.

I also disagree with CCW?CHL/ what ever you want to call it expemting you.   for the simple reason that the back gorund check was done a long time ago.  things happen.

[Sponsor]

[SwoopSJ]

I also disagree with CCW?CHL/ what ever you want to call it expemting you.   for the simple reason that the back gorund check was done a long time ago.  things happen.

At least in my state, any violation that would render you unfit to purchase a firearm, also demands immediate forfeiture of your CCW.  If you do not surrender it within a certain time period, the sheriff's dept. will pay you an unpleasant visit and confiscate said license.  So, in the case of KY residents, I see no reason not to give those who've jumped through the hoops a little break.  According to what you said about NCIS, my CCW is far better proof that I'm a law abiding citizen anyway.

Swoop

[fightingquaker13]

I'm not sure yu understand how the the NCIS check works.  its just a list of people that can not own guns, if your on the list, you can't buy a gun.

I also disagree with CCW?CHL/ what ever you want to call it expemting you.   for the simple reason that the back gorund check was done a long time ago.  things happen.

Again, I pretty much agree. You were a licensed driver last month, but then you got convicted of DUI two weeks ago. I do agree with SWOOP though that the CCW holder should be exempt from the absurd and archaic 5 day waiting period that Florida imposes on non-CCW holders. The background check is quick, free, and lets us say to those who use the examples of armed felons who abuse guns, "If only you enforced the laws already on the books......".
FQ13

[TAB]

I think waiting periods are a joke... it should be no more then 15-30 mins for them to get a yes or a no. 


I don't think buying a gun should be any diffrent for anyone.   LEO, CCW, or john Q public.  they should all be able to buy the exact same gun, for the exact same price and the process be exactly the same.

If you look at averages, LEOs are more likly to be convicted of a crime then the average person.( every one breaks the law, just as every one commits atleast 1 felony in thier life time.)

[alfsauve]

If you do not surrender it within a certain time period, the sheriff's dept. will pay you an unpleasant visit and confiscate said license. 

"Oh gee, sorry officer.  Evidently I lost it.  " 

[Steyr M40A1]

Again, I pretty much agree. You were a licensed driver last month, but then you got convicted of DUI two weeks ago. I do agree with SWOOP though that the CCW holder should be exempt from the absurd and archaic 5 day waiting period that Florida imposes on non-CCW holders. The background check is quick, free, and lets us say to those who use the examples of armed felons who abuse guns, "If only you enforced the laws already on the books......".
FQ13

FL is only a 3 day wait. And I have my CWP