Who's the Armored Car Guard here? Read this article.

[tfr270]

http://www.pressdemocrat.com/article/20090518/ARTICLES/905189950/1349?Title=Update-Robber-flees-the-area-with-an-accomplice

An armed man forced a Brink’s guard to lie on the ground during a lunchtime robbery Monday that shocked onlookers gathered near a downtown Sebastopol bank.

One witness described the robber walking toward the Brink’s truck parked outside the Bank of America on Healdsburg Avenue pointing what appeared to be a black handgun and yelling, “Get down! Get down! Get down!”

The unidentified guard reached for his own weapon but complied with the robber’s demands and got down on the ground, Sebastopol police said.

The witness, a Bodega Bay man who asked that his name not be used, said he gave chase as the robber fled with an orange bag filled with an undisclosed amount of cash.

Shoppers outside the Safeway store adjacent to the bank watched as the chase passed them by. The robbery occurred at about 11:50 a.m.

The suspect, described by police as a white man in his late 40s or early 50s, hopped into the passenger seat of a silver Toyota or Honda sedan parked on Keating Avenue south of the store and was driven away. The pair were still at large on Monday afternoon.

Sebastopol Police Officer Dennis Colthurst said the armed robbery involving a bank was only the second he could recall in 30 years with the city. The other occurred on February 27 of this year when a Westamerica Bank was robbed.

But the fact Monday’s robber targeted a Brink’s guard who also was armed and wore a bulletproof vest had police particularly worried.

“You have to bring different cards to the table when you rob a Brink’s truck,” said Colthurst, the lead investigator on the case.

He said the suspects likely planned the heist in advance given their knowledge of when the Brink’s truck was making the delivery and their use of a getaway car.

Police and Sonoma County sheriff’s deputies cruised the downtown area and kept watch on roads leading out of Sebastopol for any signs of the suspects. The FBI also is involved in the investigation.

Investigators said they were planning to release a composite sketch of the robber using witness descriptions.

One woman in Safeway buying groceries for dinner said she came out and saw all of the police activity at the bank.

“Everybody’s desperate. It’s the economy. We’re not surprised it’s finally happening in Sebastopol,” said town resident June Hazelton.

Because the robber was believed to be heading out of town, officials at nearby Analy High School didn’t take any measures and the school was not locked down.

Principal Chris Heller spoke with police about the robbery and they determined there wasn’t any danger for the students.

Police described the suspect as between 5 foot 10 and 6 feet tall, wearing shorts, a creme-colored baseball cap and gray-hooded sweatshirt.

Police believe he was armed with a 40-caliber Smith and Wesson handgun.

Armored cars routinely go to banks, stores and other businesses, but there have been few such robberies in recent history.

In September 2007, a Loomis armored truck courier was robbed at gunpoint while he tried to deliver a bag of cash to an Exchange Bank branch in west Santa Rosa.

Prior to that, an armored car heist in Sonoma in 1995 led to a shootout and the deaths of a guard and a robbery suspect.

That hold up was in March 1995 at a Bank of America on the Sonoma Plaza. Loomis guard Richard Price was shot and killed as he was taking money from the bank to the armored truck.

Suspect William Crouch was shot and killed by Price’s partner.

In 1984, armed men escaped with $3.6 million after using two pickups to force a Brink’s armored car off Highway 20 near Lake Mendocino.

The men were later identified as part of The Order, a group of neo-Nazi white supremacists.

A former Brink’s employee and 10 other people were later convicted of crimes related to the robbery, according to news accounts.

[jzzr83]

I used to  work for an armored truck company here in the Twin Cities.  I was amazed that when I was hired we never went through training as to what to do if we were held up.  They guy I drove with said if some one demanded the money and they were serious, don't even put your hand close to the gun, drop the bag and back up.  The money is insured, our lives are not.

[tt11758]

I used to  work for an armored truck company here in the Twin Cities.  I was amazed that when I was hired we never went through training as to what to do if we were held up.  They guy I drove with said if some one demanded the money and they were serious, don't even put your hand close to the gun, drop the bag and back up.  The money is insured, our lives are not.

Not to mention that, unlike the BG, the guard has to worry about who else might get hit if a firefight ensues.  Better just give them the money and live to drive another day.  Of course, if the BG starts lobbing rounds all bets are off!

[fightingquaker13]

Honestly, who is going to risk a bullet for $12 an hour and someone else's money? The guns are there for self defense, not to protect the cash.
FQ13

[Pathfinder]

Honestly, who is going to risk a bullet for $12 an hour and someone else's money? The guns are there for self defense, not to protect the cash.
FQ13

I worked for one client in downtown Gary Indiana - when it was the murder capital of the US. Political gift to the crooked Mayor Hatcher, putting 200 white upper middle class people into that environment. When we went out, it was in groups. If alone, as some were when walking from the IC station to the building - you got mugged, even in broad daylight.

I bring this up because some of the sheeple were very happy to have the armed guards on the building - until I, ever the helpful sort, pointed out that they were there before us as the building was a payment center for the utility we worked for. Therefore, they were there for the money, not defense.

Nothing like walking out of work in the afternoon and hearing gunshots in the not too distant distance.

[Sponsor]

[Fatman]

Honestly, who is going to risk a bullet for $12 an hour and someone else's money? The guns are there for self defense, not to protect the cash.
FQ13

Armed robbery is a forcible felony (hell, robbery is a forcible felony) and the use of lethal force is justifiable in that situation - your life is in jeopardy as an adjunct to the presence of the money. It's got nothing to do with protecting the money. Unfortunately, there is often a mentality of 'the guard is expendable' in these robberies.  Each guard needs to judge each situation on its own merits and act accordingly.

Me? In this instance the money gets tossed far away and I'm heading the other way. I wouldn't be going face down or otherwise exposing myself to execution.  And, BTW watch the vid at the link - this Brinks crew's driver is negligent. He did not even realize his partner had been robbed.  

[warhawke]

I worked armored car in Detroit in the late 80's and early '90's. No matter what you do in armored you can get screwed. Like the guys that strayed into Ohio and got charged with carrying weapons (before Ohio's CCW law), or the guy from another company who shot an armed robber menacing his crew members and would have been charged with murder if the heads of all the local companies hadn't gone to the State AG and told him they would shut down all operations if they charged the guy and that they would tell the media why.   

We were a Federal Reserve coin repository. When we got that gig the State and the Fed's sent people to brief us.

The State A.G. rep told us that we were only authorized to use force to defend OUR lives (not our partner, civilians or anyone else) and if we used force for any other reason we would be charged and convicted.

The Fed guy said that all the money we transported from then on would be covered as Federal Liability and we were authorized to use any and all force to protect it. He further informed us that failure to use deadly force to protect the liability would make us accessories after the fact and we would be charged as such.

One of the guys asked the AG "If we shoot to defend the cash we go to jail?" and she said yes. He asked the Fed rep "If we Don't shoot to defend the cash you will put us in jail?" he said yes. "So no matter what happens we are going to jail"

I left soon after that.

[PegLeg45]

I worked armored car in Detroit in the late 80's and early '90's. No matter what you do in armored you can get screwed. Like the guys that strayed into Ohio and got charged with carrying weapons (before Ohio's CCW law), or the guy from another company who shot an armed robber menacing his crew members and would have been charged with murder if the heads of all the local companies hadn't gone to the State AG and told him they would shut down all operations if they charged the guy and that they would tell the media why.   

We were a Federal Reserve coin repository. When we got that gig the State and the Fed's sent people to brief us.

The State A.G. rep told us that we were only authorized to use force to defend OUR lives (not our partner, civilians or anyone else) and if we used force for any other reason we would be charged and convicted.

The Fed guy said that all the money we transported from then on would be covered as Federal Liability and we were authorized to use any and all force to protect it. He further informed us that failure to use deadly force to protect the liability would make us accessories after the fact and we would be charged as such.

One of the guys asked the AG "If we shoot to defend the cash we go to jail?" and she said yes. He asked the Fed rep "If we Don't shoot to defend the cash you will put us in jail?" he said yes. "So no matter what happens we are going to jail"

I left soon after that.

Dear God.           

   

[MikeBjerum]

Honestly, who is going to risk a bullet for $12 an hour and someone else's money? The guns are there for self defense, not to protect the cash.
FQ13

The vast majority of jobs are paying just a fraction of the value of what we handle, construct, fabricate or transport.  It is about integrity and work ethic.  Right and Wrong.  Law enforcement and military get next to nothing for protecting us, our property and our way of life - should they just roll over rather than do their jobs?

OK, these guys lived to go home and see their loved ones.  However, they could just as well been executed (an outcome you only find by playing Russian Roulette), and now the bad guys have learned they can get by with this.  How long before a driver or bystander is injured or killed by one of these or the many copycats (appologies to Haz) out there?

[tombogan03884]

It already happens way to often that the guards are taken out first.