Author Topic: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?  (Read 2332 times)

tombogan03884

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Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« on: June 18, 2009, 10:02:26 PM »
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090619/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_election

TEHRAN, Iran – Hundreds of thousands of protesters dressed in black and green flooded the streets of Tehran on Thursday in a somber, candlelit show of defiance and mourning for those killed in clashes after Iran's disputed presidential election. The massive march — the fourth this week — sent a powerful message that opposition leader Mir Hossein Mousavi has the popular backing to sustain his unprecedented challenge to Iran's ruling clerics.

Even President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, named the landslide winner in the June 12 election, appeared to take the growing opposition more seriously and backtracked on his dismissal of the protesters as "dust" and sore losers.

The government tried to placate Mousavi and his supporters by inviting him and two other candidates who ran against Ahmadinejad to a meeting Saturday with Iran's main electoral authority, the Guardian Council. Abbasali Khadkhodaei, a spokesman for the council, said it received 646 complaints from the three candidates.

Mousavi accuses the government of widespread vote-rigging and demands a full recount or a new election, flouting the will of Iran's supreme leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei — a man endowed with virtually limitless powers under its constitution.

Many in the huge crowd walked silently and lit black candles as night fell. Others wore green wristbands or ribbons and carried flowers as they filed into Imam Khomeini Square, a large plaza in the heart of the capital named for the founder of the Islamic Revolution, witnesses said.

Mousavi, dressed in a black suit, was almost swallowed up by the throng as he addressed them briefly through a handheld loudspeaker. Press TV, an English-language version of Iranian state television designed for foreigners, said he called for calm and self-restraint from the crowd that the broadcaster estimated in the hundreds of thousands.

Foreign news organizations have been barred from reporting on Tehran's streets.

For the fifth straight night, Ahmadinejad opponents went to their rooftops in Tehran and cried out "Allahu akbar!" — "God is great!" The rooftop shouting is a deeply symbolic tactic that Mousavi borrowed from the Islamic Revolution and the idea that people power can challenge any system. The rooftop cries were how Khomeini asked Iran to show its unity against the shah 30 years ago.

Hundreds of thousands, including middle-class families and religious men and women, have flocked to Tehran's streets in recent days to declare their support for Mousavi. Similar, smaller protests have popped up in other cities in Iran.

Protesters have focused on the results of the balloting rather than challenging the Islamic system of government. But a shift in anger toward Iran's non-elected theocracy could result in a showdown over the foundation of Iran's system of rule.

"I don't think everyone wants to end the Islamic Republic because many people in Iran are very religious. So I think this current movement should keep Islam in it to maintain support. Unity is important," said a 29-year-old engineering graduate.

He, like the other witnesses the AP talked to, spoke on condition of anonymity because they feared reprisal.

The demonstrators marched silently until they reached the central square, where some chanted "Death to the dictator!" a witness said. Another said protesters also warned the government: "We will not get exhausted and we will come every day."

Television footage showed protesters making V-for-victory gestures and holding pictures of Mousavi and signs that say "Where's our Vote?"

The groundswell of support appears to have taken Iran's leaders — and even Mousavi supporters — by surprise.

This week's rallies openly defied orders from Khamenei, who has urged the people to pursue their allegations of election fraud within the limits of the cleric-led system.

Thursday's march was similar to one on Monday, when hundreds of thousands turned out in a huge procession that recalled the scale of protests during the 1979 Islamic Revolution which ended the monarchy. Seven demonstrators were shot and killed that day by pro-regime militia in the first confirmed deaths during the unrest.

The crowds in Tehran and elsewhere have been able to organize despite a government clampdown on the Internet and cell phones. The government has blocked certain Web sites, such as BBC Farsi, Facebook, Twitter and several pro-Mousavi sites that are vital conduits for Iranians to tell the world about protests and violence. Other sites are slow to connect.

Text messaging, which is a primary source of spreading information in Tehran, has not been working since last week, and cell phone service in Tehran is frequently down.

The government initially tried to dismiss Mousavi's election allegations and supporter anger, but after four days of sustained protest, Ahmadinejad appeared to backtrack on his criticism and take the growing opposition more seriously.

"I was only addressing those who rioted, set fires and attack people. I said they are nothing," Ahmadinejad said in a previously taped video shown Thursday on state TV. "Every single Iranian is valuable. Government is a service to all."

The Guardian Council, an unelected body of 12 clerics and Islamic law experts close to Khamenei, has said it was prepared to conduct a limited recount of ballots at sites where candidates claim irregularities. But Mousavi says the council supports Ahmadinejad, and he has demanded an independent investigation and a new election.

The ruling clerics still command deep public support and are defended by Iran's most powerful military force — the Revolutionary Guard — as well as a vast network of militias.

But Mousavi's movement has forced Khamenei into the center of the escalating crisis, questioning his role as the final authority on all critical issues.

"I don't think the supreme leader was that upset about the idea of Mousavi being president. What he was upset about was the image of this green revolution and this wave of ordinary people having people power," said Patrick Clawson, deputy director at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. "Certainly now the big concern is if you give into these people, that suggests these sorts of popular protests can succeed, and that's not good from Khamenei's perspective."

Khamenei is scheduled to lead Friday's prayers, though it is unclear what he will say, if anything, about Mousavi and the demonstrations. At least one candidate who ran against Ahmadinejad, reformist Mahdi Karroubi, has said he will attend the service at Tehran University.

It was not known if Mousavi or Ahmadinejad would be there, although the president normally attends Friday prayers when Khamenei leads them.

Shortly after the election, Mousavi appealed for the backing of clerics in the holy city of Qom, Iran's seat of Islamic learning and a critical political base for the theocracy. He received shows of solidarity from several liberal ayatollahs but has not captured widespread support.

Ahmadinejad appears similarly unable to draw the support of the country's highest-ranking clerics, whose rulings are followed by vast numbers of Iranians. Many congratulated Khamenei for holding the election but any mention of Ahmadinejad's victory was noticeably absent.

Mohsen Rezaei, a conservative who also ran for president, said there was pressure on some religious leaders to support the election results.

"Over the past three nights, some go to a nearby city and harshly ask why they do not take their stance (to support the results)," Rezaei said on state TV Thursday, without elaborating.

Some analysts suggest Mousavi, who was prime minister in the 1980s, is not looking to change the core foundations of Iran's Islamic regime.

"He is a leader of a revolution against a system of which he's been an integral part of," said Mehran Kamrawa, director of the Center for International and Regional Studies at Georgetown University in Qatar.

There have been widespread accusations of nighttime attacks on Mousavi supporters by pro-government militia, and protesters attacked a militia building after one rally. But both sides have been restrained, with uniformed police and other security forces standing by as protesters march calmly through the streets.

The Iranian government directly accused the United States of meddling in the deepening crisis. A statement by state-run Press TV blamed Washington for "intolerable" interference. The report, on Press TV, cited no evidence.

On Thursday, state TV said four people had been arrested in Iran for allegedly plotting to set off bombs on election day. It aired what it described as a confession by one of the arrested, who said he has been working with Americans.


Rastus

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2009, 06:29:20 AM »
The sheep are being well taken care of here...too much so for anything like that.  Some fairly widespread floggings and jailings coupled with food or other shortages and backed up by people taken from home for interrogation that never return might begin to change that.

Those things appear to be in our future.
Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom.
It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.
-William Pitt, British Prime-Minister (1759-1806)
                                                                                                                               Avoid subjugation, join the NRA!

philw

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2009, 07:15:45 AM »
well Schwarzenegger is handing them out 

http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=7301.0

Here’s to the crazy ones. The misfits. The rebels. The troublemakers. The round pegs in the square holes. The ones who see things differently. They’re not fond of rules. And they have no respect for the status quo. You can praise them, disagree with them, quote them, disbelieve them, glorify or vilify them. The only thing you can’t do is ignore them

tombogan03884

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2009, 01:17:28 PM »
The sheep are being well taken care of here...too much so for anything like that.  Some faily widespread floggings and jailings coupled with food or other shortages and backed up by people taken from home for interrogation that never return might begin to change that.

Those things appear to be in our future.

They are not that far off.

Kid Shelleen

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2009, 03:14:51 PM »
The sheep are being well taken care of here...too much so for anything like that.  Some faily widespread floggings and jailings coupled with food or other shortages and backed up by people taken from home for interrogation that never return might begin to change that.

Those things appear to be in our future.
Just a matter of time Rastus. You are right on the money.
“What country can preserve its liberties if its rulers are not warned from time to time that the people preserve the spirit of resistance?”

Thomas Jefferson, 1787

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #5 on: Today at 04:16:05 PM »

tombogan03884

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2009, 11:01:55 AM »
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090620/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_election

TEHRAN, Iran – Police beat protesters and fired tear gas and water cannons at thousands who rallied Saturday in open defiance of Iran's clerical government, sharply escalating the most serious internal conflict since the 1979 Islamic Revolution.

Eyewitnesses described fierce clashes after some 3,000 protesters, many wearing black, chanted "Death to the dictator!" and "Death to dictatorship!" near Revolution Square in downtown Tehran. Police fired tear gas, water cannons and guns but it was not clear if they were firing live ammunition.

Some protesters appeared to be fighting back, setting fire to militia members' motorcycles, witnesses said. Helicopters hovered, ambulances raced through the streets and black smoke rose over the city.

Police and militia were blocking protesters from gathering on the main thoroughfare running east from Revolution Square to Freedom Square, the witnesses said.

A massive rally in Freedom Square Monday set off three consecutive days of protests demanding the government cancel and rerun June 12 elections that ended with a declaration of overwhelming victory for hardline President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. Reformist presidential candidate Mir Hossein Mousavi says he won and Ahmadinejad stole the election through widespread fraud. Mousavi has not been seen since or issued public comment since a rally Thursday.

Web sites run by Mousavi supporters had said he planned to post a message, but there was no statement by the time of the planned street protests at 4 p.m. (7:30 a.m. EDT, 1130 GMT). Some pro-reform Web sites called for people to take to the streets.

Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei sternly warned opposition leaders Friday to end street protests or be held responsible for "the bloodshed, the violence and rioting" to come. The statement effectively closed the door to Mousavi's demand for a new election, ratcheting up the possibility of a violent confrontation.

As reports of street clashes became public, Iran's English-language state TV said that a suicide bombing at the shrine of Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini about 12 miles (20 kilometers) south of central Tehran had killed one person and wounded eight. The report could not be independently confirmed due to government restrictions on independent reporting.

The channel also confirmed that police had used batons and other non-lethal weapons against what it called unauthorized demonstrations.

Amateur video showed dozens of Iranians running down a street after police fired tear gas at them. Shouts of "Allahu Akbar!" — "God is Great" — could be heard on the video, which could not be independently verified.

The witnesses told The Associated Press that between 50 and 60 protesters were hospitalized after beatings by police and pro-government militia. People could be seen dragging away comrades bloodied by baton strikes.

Police clashed with protesters around Tehran immediately after the presidential election. Gunfire from a militia compound left at least seven dead, but further force had remained in check until Saturday.

Eyewitnesses said thousands of police and plainclothes militia members filled the streets to prevent rallies. Fire trucks took up positions in Revolution Square and riot police surrounded Tehran University, the site of recent clashes between protesters and security forces, one witness said.

Tehran Province Police Chief Ahmad Reza Radan said that police would "crack down on any gathering or protest rally which are being planned by some people." The head of the State Security Council also reiterated a warning to Mousavi that he would be held responsible if he encouraged protests.

Tehran University, which sits in the heart of downtown Tehran, was cordoned off by police and militia while students inside the university chanted "Death to the dictator!" witnesses said.

Shouts of "Viva Mousavi!" also could be heard. Witnesses said protesters wore black as a symbol of mourning for the dead and the allegedly stolen election, with wristbands in green, the emblem of Mousavi's self-described "Green Wave" movement.

All witnesses spoke on condition of anonymity because they feared government reprisals for speaking with the press. Iranian authorities have placed strict limits on the ability of foreign media to cover recent events, banning reporting from the street and allowing only phone interviews and information from officials sources such as state TV.

"I think the regime has taken an enormous risk in confronting this situation in the manner that they have," said Mehrdad Khonsari, a consultant to the London-based Center for Arab and Iranian Studies.

"Now they'll have to hold their ground and hope that people don't keep coming back. But history has taught us that people in these situations lose their initial sense of fear and become emboldened by brutality," he said.

Mousavi and the two other candidates who ran against Ahmadinejad had been invited to meet with Iran's Guardian Council, an unelected body of 12 clerics and Islamic law experts close to Khamenei that oversees elections. Its spokesman told state TV that Mousavi and the reformist candidate Mahdi Karroubi did not attend.

The council has said it was prepared to conduct a limited recount of ballots at sites where candidates claim irregularities but Mousavi's supporters did not withdraw his demands for a new election.

Both houses of the U.S. Congress approved a resolution on Friday condemning "the ongoing violence" by the Iranian government and its suppression of the Internet and cell phones.

The government has blocked Web sites such as BBC Farsi, Facebook, Twitter and several pro-Mousavi sites that are conduits for Iranians to tell the world about protests and violence.

Text messaging has not been working normally for many days, and cell phone service in Tehran is frequently down.

In an interview taped Friday with CBS, Obama said he is very concerned by the "tenor and tone" of Khamenei's comments. He also said that how Iran's leaders "approach and deal with people who are, through peaceful means, trying to be heard" will signal "what Iran is and is not."

A spokesman for Mousavi said Friday the opposition leader was not under arrest but was not allowed to speak to journalists or stand at a microphone at rallies. Iranian filmmaker Mohsen Makhmalbaf told the AP from Paris it was even becoming difficult to reach people close to Mousavi. He said he had not heard from Mousavi's camp since Khamenei's address.

tt11758

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2009, 01:55:46 PM »
The government has blocked Web sites such as BBC Farsi, Facebook, Twitter and several pro-Mousavi sites that are conduits for Iranians to tell the world about protests and violence.

Text messaging has not been working normally for many days, and cell phone service in Tehran is frequently down.



Wonder how long it will be before we see that kind of tech-failure here in the USA.
I love waking up every morning knowing that Donald Trump is President!!

tombogan03884

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Re: Hey America, where are YOUR balls ?
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2009, 06:01:54 PM »
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090620/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_election
  
These people have no guns, just guts.
TEHRAN, Iran – Thousands of protesters defied Iran's highest authority Saturday and marched on waiting security forces that fought back with baton charges, tear gas and water cannons as the crisis over disputed elections lurched into volatile new ground.

In a separate incident, a state-run television channel reported that a suicide bombing at the shrine of the Islamic Revolution leader Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini killed at least two people and wounded eight. The report could be not independently evaluated due to government restrictions on journalists.

If proven true, the reports could enrage conservatives and bring strains among backers of opposition leader Mir Hossein Mousavi. Another state channel broadcast images of broken glass but no other damage or casualties, and showed a witness saying three people had been wounded.

The extent of injuries in the street battles also was unclear. Some witnesses said dozens were hurt and gunfire was heard.

The clashes along one of Tehran's main avenues — as described by witnesses — had far fewer demonstrators than recent mass rallies for Mousavi. But they marked another blow to authorities who sought to intimidate protesters with harsh warnings and lines of black-clad police three deep in places.

The rallies also left questions about Mousavi's ability to hold together his protest movement, which claims that widespread fraud in June 12 elections robbed Mousavi of victory and kept hardline President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in office.

Mousavi bewildered many followers by not directly replying to the ultimatum issued Friday by Iran's most powerful figure, Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei. His stern order to Mousavi and others: Call off demonstrations or risk being held responsible for "bloodshed, violence and rioting."

A police commander sharpened the message Saturday. Gen. Esmaeil Ahmadi Moghadam said more than a week of unrest and marches had become "exhausting, bothersome and intolerable." He threatened a more "serious confrontation" if protesters return.

Mousavi's silence was broken after the melee with another call to annul the election results. But there was no mention of the clashes — suggesting he wants to distance himself from the violence and possibly opening the door for more militant factions to break away.

Amateur video showed clashes erupting in the southern city of Shiraz and witnesses reported street violence in Isfahan, south of Tehran.

"I think the regime has taken an enormous risk in confronting this situation in the manner that they have," said Mehrdad Khonsari, a consultant to the London-based Center for Arab and Iranian Studies.

"Now they'll have to hold their ground and hope that people don't keep coming back," he added. "But history has taught us that people in these situations lose their initial sense of fear and become emboldened by brutality."

In Washington, President Barack Obama urged Iranian authorities to halt "all violent and unjust actions against its own people." He said the United States "stands by all who seek to exercise" the universal rights to assembly and free speech.

Obama has offered to open talks with Iran to ease a nearly 30-year diplomatic freeze, but the upheaval could complicate any attempts at outreach.

Full details of the street battles could not be obtained because of Iranian media restrictions. But witnesses described scenes that could sharply escalate the most serious internal conflict since the 1979 Islamic Revolution.

An estimated 3,000 marchers — some chanting "Death to dictatorship!" — marched directly onto a blockade of security forces keeping them from approaching Azadi Square, where Mousavi gathered hundreds of thousands of people on Monday.

Police first fired tear gas and water cannons at the protesters, witnesses said. Then came a second wave. It included volunteer militiamen on motorcycles chasing down demonstrators.

Witnesses claimed some marchers were beaten with batons by security forces or metal pipes wielded by the militiamen known as Basijis, who are directed by the powerful Revolutionary Guard.

An old woman cloaked in a head-to-toe black chador shouted, "Death to the dictator," drawing the attention of Basij members who ran from the other side of the street and clubbed her, according to one witness contacted by the AP.

Protesters lit trash bins on fire — sending pillars of black smoke over the city — and hurled rocks. Some managed to wrestle away a few motorcycles and set them ablaze.

One witness told The Associated Press that people came from apartments to aid the wounded demonstrators or allowed them to take shelter. Helicopters hovered over central Tehran until dusk.

The witnesses told AP that between 50 and 60 protesters were seriously beaten by police and pro-government militia and taken to Imam Khomeini hospital in central Tehran. People could be seen dragging away comrades bloodied by baton strikes.

Nearby, Tehran University was cordoned off by police and militia.

On the streets, witnesses said some protesters also shouted "Death to Khamenei!" — another sign of once unthinkable challenges to the authority of the successor of Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, the father of the Islamic Revolution.

All witnesses spoke on condition of anonymity because they feared government reprisals. Iranian authorities have placed strict limits on the ability of foreign media to cover events, banning reporting from the street and allowing only phone interviews and information from officials sources such as state TV.

Mousavi, who served was prime minister during the 1980s, is not believed to seek the collapse of the Islamic system. But he claims that state powers were abused to skew the election results and re-elect Ahmadinejad in a landslide.

That stand has increasingly brought him and his supporters into direct confrontation with Iran's highest authorities.

A statement on Mousavi's Web site said he and his supporters were not seeking to confront their "brothers" among Iran's security forces or the "sacred system" that preserves the country's freedom and independence.

"We are confronting deviations and lies. We seek to bring reform that returns us to the pure principals of the Islamic Republic," it said.

Khamenei sided firmly with Ahmadinejad on Friday, saying the vote reflected popular will and ordering opposition leaders to end street protests.

A report on Press TV listed the fallout from the unrest, including 700 buildings and 300 banks damaged and 400 police hurt. It gave no similar list for the protesters. At least seven people have died, according to the official Iranian count, but the total could be more.

Mousavi's extremely slim hope of having the election results annulled rest with Iran's Guardian Council, an unelected body of 12 clerics and Islamic law experts. But Mousavi and another moderate candidate in the race, Mahdi Karroubi, did not appear at a meeting called to discuss their allegations of fraud, a council official told state TV.

The council has said it was prepared to conduct a limited recount of ballots at sites where candidates claim irregularities.

In a letter to the council, posted on one of Mousavi's Web site, he listed alleged violations that include his representatives being expelled from polling stations and fake ballots at some mobile polling stations.

The government has blocked Web sites such as BBC Farsi, Facebook, Twitter and several pro-Mousavi sites used by Iranians to tell the world about protests and violence. Text messaging has not been working in Iran since last week, and cell phone service in Tehran is frequently down.

But that won't stifle the opposition networks, said Sami Al Faraj, president of the Kuwait Center for Strategic Studies.

"They can resort to whispering ... they can do it the old-fashioned way," he said.


 

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