Can o' worms

[bbbean]

On that, I am in total agreement.
Pro's might have more opportunities to see different perspectives than some of us do, but it still don't make them the 'end-all top authorities' on a particular subject.

I'm curious - if decades of being a top shooter and top gunsmith and working closely with the best in the business to design, test, and compete with the best guns in the world doesn't make someone an authority, what does? Granted, if Todd Jarret or Jerry Miculek, or Michael Voight, or any of the dozen or two people with comparable experience voiced an opposing opinion, you'd have to take them pretty seriously, too, but what other criteria would you use to declare someone an "authority"?

[PegLeg45]

I'm curious - if decades of being a top shooter and top gunsmith and working closely with the best in the business to design, test, and compete with the best guns in the world doesn't make someone an authority, what does? Granted, if Todd Jarret or Jerry Miculek, or Michael Voight, or any of the dozen or two people with comparable experience voiced an opposing opinion, you'd have to take them pretty seriously, too, but what other criteria would you use to declare someone an "authority"?

So, you're saying if Rob Leatham (and I respect him for what he does, and was in no way jabbing at him, just pointing out that you need to get information from many different sources before making an educated decision) told you to lube your 1911 with horsesh*t, you'd do it because he's an expert?

[Timothy]

Can-o-worms run amok!

I have an opinion based on my experience.  I don't expect anyone to respect my opinion until and when the come to know me and conversely, I don't respect people merely for their experiences or opinions until and when I get to know them.

I mean no disrespect to any professional shooter, golfer, engineer, architect or garbageman.  The term professional merely means that individual gets paid to perform a task or function.  They can either be GOOD or BAD at what they do.  Simple as that.

I had a few doctors try their very, very best to harvest my internal organs BEFORE I was finished using them.  They are considered PROFESSIONALS in their field but every year they manage to kill tens of thousands of people as a result of their incompetence.

From here on out, I want to be considered a Professional Fat-ass because I DO get paid to sit on it 40 hours a week and it has managed to become one of the larger features on my 6'1". 265# body....

All in good fun, lets keep it civil.....

[deamonpi]

I am not trying to bad mouth any one, especially not Rob Leatham.  But, in order to win me over, I would need to see some good, reproducible data to back up any claim.  Not just the advice of a shooter, and not just because it hasn't been dis proven.  If you want to claim FLGR are better than the standard guide rod, then by all means produce your evidence, with a statistical analysis.  I don't want to see raw data, with your guess as to what the data says, run the regression and prove it.  Until then quit trying to convince everyone you meet that FLGR are the bee's knees, and let bygones be bygones.  I'll use my shorty guide rod and you can use your extra long guide rod, and we can live in peace.  No dogs and cats living together, no problems.

[onrecess]

Can-o-worms run amok!

...
I mean no disrespect to any professional shooter, golfer, engineer, architect or garbageman.  The term professional merely means that individual gets paid to perform a task or function.  They can either be GOOD or BAD at what they do.  Simple as that.

I had a few doctors try their very, very best to harvest my internal organs BEFORE I was finished using them.  They are considered PROFESSIONALS in their field but every year they manage to kill tens of thousands of people as a result of their incompetence.

Please forgive my edit, I just want to show what I'm aiming at here. The problem is also one of definition. Professional can be, and is, used to show you have lost amatuer status by getting paid. The definition as referring to the doctors is the definition is then of a person who has been educated into a learned profession (teaching, medicine, law, business...) and the defining of said person as an expert. (Putting aside individual judgements of any particular profession. My opinion of doctors agreeing with yours. )
We rely on experts so we don't have to study every thing ourselves, (our cars, guns, RVs, TVs, MP3s, computers, education, law, medicine, stain removal  ). 

Would we clean our guns with crap if an expert said so? Well, yes. Thousands of houswives and mothers put peanut butter into kid's hair to get chewing gum out. Is anyone really going to claim they don't rely on expert opinions all day in every asspect of life? Well, maybe a hermit like the unibomber. The rest of us? Of course we do. How many of us are going to experiment with oil change intervals in OUR new car/truck/RV?

[Sponsor]

[tombogan03884]

Please forgive my edit, I just want to show what I'm aiming at here. The problem is also one of definition. Professional can be, and is, used to show you have lost amatuer status by getting paid. The definition as referring to the doctors is the definition is then of a person who has been educated into a learned profession (teaching, medicine, law, business...) and the defining of said person as an expert. (Putting aside individual judgements of any particular profession. My opinion of doctors agreeing with yours. )
We rely on experts so we don't have to study every thing ourselves, (our cars, guns, RVs, TVs, MP3s, computers, education, law, medicine, stain removal  ). 

Would we clean our guns with crap if an expert said so? Well, yes. Thousands of houswives and mothers put peanut butter into kid's hair to get chewing gum out. Is anyone really going to claim they don't rely on expert opinions all day in every asspect of life? Well, maybe a hermit like the unibomber. The rest of us? Of course we do. How many of us are going to experiment with oil change intervals in OUR new car/truck/RV?

What exactly in your exalted opinion is wrong with people who do not wish to participate in your travesty of a society ?
Other than it offends your anti American socialist sensibilities and need for government control ?

[onrecess]

Exactly? Well, they are sociopaths. (That is generally regarded as being "nuts" by people in a society.)
Other than that? Nothing really. I don't mind hermits or sociopaths until they start shooting people or sending bombs through the mail. I admit to finding them an object of ridicule and humor. I wouldn't send in the FBI as in Ruby Ridge or Waco.

[tombogan03884]

Exactly? Well, they are sociopaths. (That is generally regarded as being "nuts" by people in a society.)
Other than that? Nothing really. I don't mind hermits or sociopaths until they start shooting people or sending bombs through the mail. I admit to finding them an object of ridicule and humor. I wouldn't send in the FBI as in Ruby Ridge or Waco.

 I'm not surprised that you find self reliant people offensive, after all, you aren't and they are the ones who made America great.
Of course socialists like you elected a post turtle who's going to "Change that".

[bbbean]

What exactly in your exalted opinion is wrong with people who do not wish to participate in your travesty of a society ?
Other than it offends your anti American socialist sensibilities and need for government control ?

So the Unabomber was just a fine American who had different ideas about technology and society? Do you endorse his methods?

[tombogan03884]

So the Unabomber was just a fine American who had different ideas about technology and society? Do you endorse his methods?

Most hermits are nothing like the Unibomber, who I will point out was a Liberal teacher from Berkley.
You should think about that.