I CAN'T STOP YELLING AT MY TV!!! PLEASE MAKE IT STOP!!!!

[twyacht]

thanks tom,... he pulled the Kennedy Card, $900BILLION over 10 years without adding to the deficit? Kennedy wanted healthcare not out of ideology?? Are you kidding me?

In the 1960's when Medicare passed, the CONGRESS estimated costs by 1990 at $12BILLION.....

In 1990, it was over $400BILLION!!!!! That's a big freakin oooooppsss. Mass. Care, is breaking the state, it has overrun all costs projected by the "experts".... Give me a break....

A one liner on tort reform, not one mention of the PEOPLE'S wishes...

No mention of Worker's Comp fraud, medicare fraud, which totals BILLIONS every year....

The 1200 insurance companies in 2007 made 12.9 billion dollars in profit.,,..okay, Medicare lost over $60BILLION the same year...



These numbers are from the CBO office website, I defer to the abuse, within the governments own programs, let alone the VA.

All Vets should be given a prepaid debit card to go see who they want for medical care, at NO COST. ....THAT is an expense I would gladly support,

the rest is BS.


Thanks m58, and Timothy, they are amazing as I was flipping back and forth...

[MikeBjerum]

By the way -

Was that a seating chart that Pelosi looked at when someone called him on a lie about not providing coverage for illegals?

I don't need to research to know that was a flat out lie.  The big D has been on a roll for years to extend everything possible to illegals, and health care is one of their hot topics.  

And, how about the lie that no government money will every go for abortion  You mean to tell me that every gubment employee or family member and every medicaid recipient that got an abortion paid it out of their own pocket  If so, how does that match with the court's rulings that it is unConstitutional to deny abortions to anyone that can't afford them

I'm going to read the transcript later and then drink heavy  

[tombogan03884]

Check out the thread Liberal lies about health care #4 That I just put up.
Ann addresses both of those issues
http://www.downrange.tv/forum/index.php?topic=8788.msg113373#msg113373

What she fails to mention is that they are planning on pushing through an Amnesty bill next year so there won't BE any illegals.

[alfsauve]

I am trying to listen to the BHO speech, but I find myself yelling at him on my TV....

I hate to be the one to tell you this, but unless your TV has some problem or other there should be a pair of buttons marked "Channel +"  and "Channel -"   By simply pressing one or the other you could have eliminated the source of your irritation.  (Well not eliminated in the literal sense, but at least removed it from your immediate sensory perception.)

In fact I would have recommend you turn over to a channel carrying the US Open tennis match where you could have watched a vary nice young lady, from my neighborhood, Ms. Oudin, play an excellent match.  Though she lost, tonight, she joins a select few very talented ladies who have made it to the quarter finals before they were 18 years old.  We locals, (Mareitta, GA) are proud of Melanie, and know she will improve as she get more experience in the "big leagues" under her racket.

As for the socialist occupying the "big" networks tonight, blathering on about taking over the world, I'll read all about his speech in tomorrows paper.

[alfsauve]

Already "barackobama.com" has sent out an email asking people to contact the congress critter.

I don't know if you've seen the logo they use for the "obamacare" web pages.

Am I the only one, or does anyone else find it scary?

[Sponsor]

[alfsauve]

Or how about this image?   It really bothers me.   Images of storm troopers, crystal night, youth corp just keep coming to mind.  No coincidence he spoke to schools yesterday and congress today.

[tombogan03884]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090910/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_health_care_fact_check

WASHINGTON – The change was subtle, but significant. In his speech to Congress on Wednesday night, President Barack Obama gave a more accurate — and less reassuring — account of the impact of his proposed health care overall than he has done in the past. It went by in a blink.

He told Americans that nothing he is proposing will force businesses or consumers to change their existing insurance coverage. That much is true.

It's also true that nothing in his plan guarantees that policies people have now will continue to be available in the same form. In earlier accounts, he spoke with unmerited certainty in saying people who are happy with their current insurance can simply keep it.

Other parts of his speech repeated some of the oversimplified claims that have marked his salesmanship. A look at some of his assertions Wednesday night:

OBAMA: "Nothing in this plan will require you or your employer to change the coverage or the doctor you have. Let me repeat this: Nothing in our plan requires you to change what you have."

THE FACTS: That's correct, as far as it goes. But neither can the plan guarantee that people can keep their current coverage. Employers sponsor coverage for most families, and they'd be free to change their health plans in ways that workers may not like, or drop insurance altogether. The Congressional Budget Office analyzed the health care bill written by House Democrats and said that by 2016 some 3 million people who now have employer-based care would lose it because their employers would decide to stop offering it.

In the past Obama repeatedly said, "If you like your health care plan, you'll be able to keep your health care plan, period." Now he's stopping short of that unconditional guarantee by saying nothing in the plan "requires" any change.

He's dropped the "period."

___

OBAMA: "I will not sign a plan that adds one dime to our deficits either now or in the future. Period."

THE FACTS: Despite this "period," the White House and congressional Democrats have already shown they're ready to skirt the no-new-deficits pledge.

House Democrats offered a bill that the Congressional Budget Office said would add $220 billion to the deficit over 10 years. But Democrats and Obama administration officials claimed the bill was actually deficit-neutral. They said they simply didn't have to count $245 billion of it — the cost of adjusting Medicare reimbursement rates so physicians don't face big annual pay cuts.

Their only-in-Washington reasoning was that they already decided to exempt this so-called "doc fix" from congressional rules that require new programs to be paid for. In other words, it doesn't have to be paid for because they decided it doesn't have to be paid for.

The administration also said that since Obama already included the doctor payment in his 10-year budget proposal, it didn't have to be counted again.

Even aside from that, the long-term prognosis for the costs of the health care legislation has not been good.

Congressional Budget Office Director Douglas Elmendorf had this to say in July about evolving health care legislation: "We do not see the sort of fundamental changes that would be necessary to reduce the trajectory of federal health spending by a significant amount. And on the contrary, the legislation significantly expands the federal responsibility for health care costs."

___

OBAMA: Requiring insurance companies to cover preventive care like mammograms and colonoscopies "makes sense, it saves money, and it saves lives."

The facts: Studies have shown that much preventive care — particularly tests like the ones Obama mentions — actually costs money instead of saving it. That's because detecting acute diseases like breast cancer in their early stages involves testing many people who would never end up developing the disease. The costs of a large number of tests, even if they're relatively cheap, will outweigh the costs of caring for the minority of people who would have ended up getting sick without the testing.

The Congressional Budget Office wrote in August: "The evidence suggests that for most preventive services, expanded utilization leads to higher, not lower, medical spending overall."

That doesn't mean preventive care doesn't make sense or save lives. It just doesn't save money.

___

OBAMA: "If you lose your job or change your job, you will be able to get coverage. If you strike out on your own and start a small business, you will be able to get coverage."

THE FACTS: It's not just a matter of being able to get coverage. Most people would have to get coverage under the law, if his plan is adopted.

In his speech, Obama endorsed mandatory coverage for individuals, an approach he did not embrace as a candidate.

He proposed during the campaign — as he does now — that larger businesses be required to offer insurance to workers or else pay into a fund. But he rejected the idea of requiring individuals to obtain insurance. He said people would get insurance without being forced to do so by the law, if coverage were made affordable. And he repeatedly criticized his Democratic primary rival, Hillary Rodham Clinton, for proposing to mandate coverage.

"To force people to get health insurance, you've got to have a very harsh penalty," he said in a February 2008 debate.

Now, he says, "individuals will be required to carry basic health insurance — just as most states require you to carry auto insurance."

He proposes a hardship waiver, exempting from the requirement those who cannot afford coverage despite increased federal aid.

[MikeBjerum]

Just heard that Representative Wilson has called the White House and spoke to the Chief of Staff.  He apologized for his outburst (yelling "liar") at the comments on coverage for illegals.  He apologized for his "break in civility," but he did not apologize for or correct his stance.

[fightingquaker13]

Just heard that Representative Wilson has called the White House and spoke to the Chief of Staff.  He apologized for his outburst (yelling "liar") at the comments on coverage for illegals.  He apologized for his "break in civility," but he did not apologize for or correct his stance.

I'm glad to hear that. There are somethings you just don't do. Particularly as a member of Congress. That being said, the prospect of lowering pay for Dr.s both irritates and scares me. I dated a surgeon for a while. She went through hell to get her degree and twice that hell in her residency. The hours she worked would have had a Marine DI court martialed if he did that to a recruit. Where the hell are we supposed to get people who will work in the chaos and squalor of an ER or the nighmare of a nursing home or oncology ward if they don'tget paid? (That goes for nurses and orderlies as well).
FQ13

[tombogan03884]

I'm glad to hear that. There are somethings you just don't do. Particularly as a member of Congress. That being said, the prospect of lowering pay for Dr.s both irritates and scares me. I dated a surgeon for a while. She went through hell to get her degree and twice that hell in her residency. The hours she worked would have had a Marine DI court martialed if he did that to a recruit. Where the hell are we supposed to get people who will work in the chaos and squalor of an ER or the nighmare of a nursing home or oncology ward if they don'tget paid? (That goes for nurses and orderlies as well).
FQ13

Smash the AMA sponsored limit on New medical schools and students for starters. Congress may (or may not) have passed limits on building more medical schools and limiting the number of people who can study medicine, but it was an AMA bill.