With apologies to FQ...

[brosometal]

With all the programs that sprout up on or near Veteran's Day I came across this tidbit of info.  I had questioned FQ of the origins of his moniker and he referenced a school mascot if I'm 'memberin' correctly.  Well, I would like to present Smedley Butler, the original Fighting Quaker:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smedley_Butler

Discuss among yourselves.  This should prove to be an interesting thread.

[tombogan03884]

Smedley Butler was a VERY controversial character in his day, while he was a Marines Marine, and a true hero by any definition he was also an avowed Socialist and anti Imperialist in an age when Imperialist expansion in the form of Island coaling stations for US shipping was imperative for the nations economic well being.
He was also an out spoken old fart who referred to Capitalism as a bigger racket than Capone had going.
When asked how he felt about serving the nation His reply was "How would YOU feel knowing you spent the last 30 years as high class muscle for United Fruit"

[brosometal]

I thought the name was funny so I googled him.  Then I saw one of his many nick-names was "fighting quaker".  I just thought I would rib FQ a bit with it...

[tombogan03884]

I saw him lurking when I posted before 

[fightingquaker13]

Butler was an intersting guy and a man of his time. He also proves that being to the left doesn't mean you can't be a patiot. The debate over Imperalism is nothing new, hell we're still having it the GOP between the Pat Buchanan/Ron Paul wing vs the Neo-cons. The elction of 1896 regarded as one of the four most important in US history was partly over this issue. Do we betray the revolution if we take colonies? Do we advance through trade and let others squander their money on a global military or do we "take up the white man's burden"? Butler was for moral and strategic reasons reluctant to take an FP position that had us overextending ourselves (in his view). He mght have been wrong, but its still something we're arguing about, even in conservative circles.
FQ13

[Sponsor]

[tombogan03884]

It's late , and I'm about to go to bed but I will point out that with out strategically placed coaling stations the US Navy would not have been capable of protecting the merchant fleet or other economic interests.
It is worth noting that when Commodore Dewey finally landed troops in Manila there were war ships from several countries at anchor waiting to gobble up the Philippines including a 5 ship fleet from Imperial Germany. Based on the conduct of the Germans in East Africa we did them a favor by declaring the Protectorate.

[fightingquaker13]

It's late , and I'm about to go to bed but I will point out that with out strategically placed coaling stations the US Navy would not have been capable of protecting the merchant fleet or other economic interests.
It is worth noting that when Commodore Dewey finally landed troops in Manila there were war ships from several countries at anchor waiting to gobble up the Philippines including a 5 ship fleet from Imperial Germany. Based on the conduct of the Germans in East Africa we did them a favor by declaring the Protectorate.

I do not disagree with the need, but a defensive alliance and a 99 year lease could have done the same thing. If not, well you do  what you have to. I'm not second guessing our policy. I'm just saying that Butler wasn't too far out the mainstream for his time on this issue, and even today there are a lot of folks who would agree to be found across the political spectrum from Pat Buchanan to Dennis Kucinch.
FQ13

[tombogan03884]

Today Butler would be an Obama Democrat so he is not one of my favorite historical figures. If he had not been so honest and earned 2 Congressional Medals of Honor I would put him in the same category with John Murtha. Butler could have had a political career if he had not suffered from the same foot in mouth syndrome that denied MacArthur the Presidential nomination.

[Clark Kent]

Today Butler would be an Obama Democrat so he is not one of my favorite historical figures. If he had not been so honest and earned 2 Congressional Medals of Honor I would put him in the same category with John Murtha. Butler could have had a political career if he had not suffered from the same foot in mouth syndrome that denied MacArthur the Presidential nomination.

I wonder about that, Tom.  Butler was a realist.  With his independent streak he mighta been more comfortable with Ron Paul or the Libertarians.   Definitely not one to follow a crowd. 

[brosometal]

As I stated before, I was watching a PBS (insert groans here) program on the Congressional Metal of Honor (CMoH) when they mentioned Smedley Butler.  They touched on his political views and also mentioned the Fighting Quaker nickname.  Needless to say, my interest was peaked.  I looked into it a little more.

The CMoHs won were before the standards were tightened up.  I say this, not to deride Butler's efforts, but for reference, and he would most definitely be a modern day Obamabot.

The thing that brought it all together, at least for me, was his alignment with the Progressive movement of the '20s.  If you have caught any of Glenn Beck's shows in the last few months that should ring a few bells.  With a little historical prospective, you can see the degradation of the Constitution.  This was at the beginning of King Roosevelt's reign, the beginning of "gun control", the beginning of federal drug regulations, and the beginning of the mammoth growth of the federal government and nanny state.

It was just a coincidence that Smedley Bulter shared a nickname with one of our forum buddies.  And if you can't give a little on-line ribbing to a buddy with buyer's remorse, what has this world come to?

P.S.  FQ,  There were no good choices for POTUS on the ballot last time.  It was a choice of where you wanted the bullet...