Will This Entitlement Mentality Ever Stop ?

[tombogan03884]

You aren't getting it CJ, Taxes are "Govt revenue" money collected for use as the Govt sees fit.
SS on the other hand was a Govt administered investment account, it was YOUR money, collected and invested for YOUR use. The Govt had no say in how it was spent.
Until the dems stole it.
It is the same as if your bank decided that since you had so much in your savings account they would take it to bribe the SEC.

[CJS3]

The tittle of this thread apllies to you. 

[tombogan03884]

The tittle of this thread apllies to you. 

Because I want to be able to keep the money I put in a savings account ?
That's idiotic.

[Timothy]

Tom and CJ....I think you guys are arguing pretty much the same argument.

Yes, SS was originally intended to supplement retirement money for the elderly until Johnson and the Congress at the time changed the rules on how it could be borrowed from.  It essentially became a slush fund for Congress and writing an IOU was all that was required.

Nowadays, it is definitely like a tax that will most likely not be there for some of the folks that get into the system after 2047 or whenever they say the program is bankrupt.  Medicare and Medicaid are entitlements that the Fed cannot afford!

Social Security should be ended in it's current format and privatized if for no other reason that the Government has a proven track record of failing at everything they've ever started.

I've got 100K of my own money PLUS my employers contributions in my SS Account as of 2010.....I want it back, one way or another.

[Solus]

I don't think Tom and CJ are anywhere near close on this one.

Tom says that since the government took the money with the agreement that they would provide retirement coverage for the contributors and that it is now a debt owed to those who did contribute.

CJ is saying that even though that was the agreement, we should consider anything we get from SS as a gift from our benevolent government.

I happen to agree with Tom.  After paying into SS since I was 18 until now at age 64 I don't want to hear that they've decided it's not a contractual obligation anymore but is now an entitlement that will be ended to help balance the budget.

As Tom has pointed out in previous threads, language is important.  If they keep repeating that SS in an entitlement rather than a contractual obligation often enough and long enough folks will be swayed into swallowing that line of crap.

[Sponsor]

[Timothy]

A buy out. Just give people what they put in to the system, in a lump sum payment, and say adios.

They're both talking about the same thing.....give us what we put into the system and be done with it..

I agree with both of these guys.  Social Security, in it's current form (bastardized, raped and otherwise fucked up) is OUR money as is all the taxes collected by the Treasury.  I also agree that Social Security was initially a supplement to our pensions BUT, for the most part, pensions no longer exist in the private sector so SS becomes for most, the only retirement that they can depend upon in their later years.

I've resigned myself to have to work until I die but I will get what I've paid in to SS one way or the other.  My wife gets 6K a year in disability and has for 16 years.  She never paid in anywhere near what she has received which is where the system fails.  I may never see the 300K that I will have put into the system but my wife will reap the benefit of an increased disability check upon my death.  She will be far better off without me than if I survive well into my eighties!

[Solus]

They're both talking about the same thing.....give us what we put into the system and be done with it..

Objection.  That is a start.  What I put in and what my employer matched as that was counted as a benefit for me and then calculate standard compound interest on that amount, which I would have earned had I placed it in the simplest of retirement plans.  That is what I would have had on my own, and that is what they owe.

If that math is beyond the capabilities of the government, banks do that type of calculation all the time.

[Timothy]

Objection.  That is a start.  What I put in and what my employer matched as that was counted as a benefit for me and then calculate standard compound interest on that amount, which I would have earned had I placed it in the simplest of retirement plans.  That is what I would have had on my own, and that is what they owe.

If that math is beyond the capabilities of the government, banks do that type of calculation all the time.

On that, we agree wholeheartedly my good friend.  I could throw darts at a mutual fund list and do better than the government has done, EVER!

[tombogan03884]

On that, we agree wholeheartedly my good friend.  I could throw darts at a mutual fund list and do better than the government has done, EVER!

Remember the Mustang Ranch Fiasco ?

[Timothy]