The .22 Affectionado

[doctorknow]

I have been shooting .22s since age 8. My father was career Air Force and during the summer we had base activities we could chose from. One summer I chose riflery. What are the chances today?

My love affair with that caliber started then. Despite the 30+ firearms, about half pistols I own, the venerable .22 remains my favorite. Yes, I even use a Walther P22 with maxi-mags as my SD firearm.

I am also a doctor and during my surgical residency saw my fair share of gunshots. The "lowly" .22 was by far the most difficult round to remove and had the highest morbidity and mortality. The surgeons had to make a disproportionately large inscision both width and depth to get to it and then there was the problem of finding it.

Those who poo poo it, have someone shoot you in a non vital area such as your arm or leg and see how long it takes for you to go into shock or syncope (pass out.) The damage is even much worse or lethal if you hit a major artery, vein, or vital organ.

Sure, larger calibers have much better stopping power and that is the objective in a law enforcement situation. Cops do not want to kill the perp (mentally they would probably like to) but it causes major career hassles. In the military, we went from the .45 in Vietnam to the 9mm in the 80s because it was more suitable for military encounters.

During my rather checkered youth, I even brought down small deer with a JC Higgins (Sears used to sell guns) single shot .22. If you feel like you need a larger caliber by all means go for it. I just get tired of people knocking the .22 when they do not understand the forensics of the caliber.

[gunman42782]

Welcome.  I, too, love the .22, and although I don't want to be shot with one, think it is a bit light for self defense.  Too, the rimfire rounds are as a general rule not as reliable as their centerfire brethern.  Seen way too many .22s that did not go off.  Even some of the high dollor stuff, every now and then you will encounter a dud round.  But, to each his own.  That is why they make so many different guns and ammo combinations.

[Ichiban]

If you are happy carrying a .22 then I'm happy for you. 

I, on the other hand, prefer to carry a larger caliber handgun for self-defense.  Just like the police, my object is to stop the bad guy as quickly and efficiently as possible.  If the bad guy lives or dies is of no concern at the time.  And I truly could not care less about how hard the bullet is to remove if he does survive.  So, I think you have your priorities a little skewed.

And I wont even mention the ethics of hunting deer with a .22.

Oh, and the selection of the 9mm for the military was more about politics and logistics than anything else.


P.S.  Welcome to the board.  Sorry to disagree with you right out of the gate but you did kind of set it up with your unconventional stance on caliber selection. 

[tombogan03884]

Got to agree with Ichiban.
The reason the military went to 9MM had nothing to do with it's effectiveness and everything to do with politics.
The choice was made, against the advice of every one who actually had to use them, for purposes of interchangeability with the other, European, NATO members who think .32 and .380 are practical service rounds.
Look at the history, the military originally dumped the .38 because it did not do the job on Filipino rebels.
How is a 9MM, approximately the same bullet, at about the same speed, going to be any better ?
That is why over the last 11 years of actual combat use all military branches have been switching back to .45 as much as possible.
On the .22, great little round, inexpensive and fun to shoot.
For self defense it's better than nothing.
Yes people die from .22's, but the objective of SD is to stop the attack, what good is it to you if your attacker bleeds out 15 minutes after beating you to death ?

[doctorknow]

For the sake of argument, let's say we get in a gunfight. You have your "big" gun and I my "little" .22. We fire at the same time. I die instantly, you hours later on the O.R. table.

Dead is dead my friend.

[Sponsor]

[Timothy]

If a .22 is all you have then it's all you have!  I carry a .38 spcl snub myself that some may find inadequate but it's hot up here at the moment!  Something is better than nothing and bigger is always better but it's still debatable!

My personal opinion (by direct observation) of the P22 for anything other than use as a hammer is my issue.  I wouldn't trust my kids P22 to fire 5 out of 10 rounds from a magazine.  It's been back and forth more than a few times to S&W!  I told her to melt it down for making plastic fishing lures or something.  

She prefers a Sig 9mm anyway..

[bjtraz]

For the sake of argument, let's say we get in a gunfight. You have your "big" gun and I my "little" .22. We fire at the same time. I die instantly, you hours later on the O.R. table.

Dead is dead my friend.

I don't have a dog in this fight, and believe EVERYONE should carry what the have the most confidence in, or feel works for them best. But your comment just proved Ichiban's point. If you die instantly, you stop attacking me, but If I die hours later, there is no evidence in this statement that says I stopped attacking you for "hours".

I'm a firm believer in "location, location, location". That it is much more important where I hit you than what I hit you with. Both have their pluses, but would you rather be hit in the arm with a .45 acp, or between the eyes with a .22 lr? I know, neither. But that is not my point. 

Brian

[Solus]

I don't have a dog in this fight, and believe EVERYONE should carry what the have the most confidence in, or feel works for them best. But your comment just proved Ichiban's point. If you die instantly, you stop attacking me, but If I die hours later, there is no evidence in this statement that says I stopped attacking you or the rest of your family for "hours".

I'm a firm believer in "location, location, location". That it is much more important where I hit you than what I hit you with. Both have their pluses, but would you rather be hit in the arm with a .45 acp, or between the eyes with a .22 lr? I know, neither. But that is not my point. 

Brian

FIFY

[alfsauve]

Very cool Dr Know.  And welcome.

Everyone here has a difference on caliber.  I'm more of a large bore revolver fan, myself, but then I'm having my second or third childhood and want to prove how macho I am at the range by rapid firing my .44Mag. 

It is refreshing to get a different take on the .22.   Many people push the round based on cost.  I would be hard pressed to find a gun review that didn't mention how cheap they are to shoot within the first paragraph (or minute if it's a video).   Over my considerable tenure in the school of hard knocks I've come to value other things more.   (I haven't graduated yet, btw.  I still struggle with the concept of value over cheapness at times.)

So anyway, again welcome.

[tombogan03884]

For the sake of argument, let's say we get in a gunfight. You have your "big" gun and I my "little" .22. We fire at the same time. I die instantly, you hours later on the O.R. table.

Dead is dead my friend.

You're not getting it.
The point is for the defender not to wind up dead.
As some one else pointed out, in between you being "dead instantly", and the attacker "hours later" , whats he done to your wife and kids ?