Connecticut school shooting

[twyacht]

My prayers are with the families and survivors of yet another tragedy utilizing firearms.

The Chinese man that slashed 22 at a school will be ignored.
http://www.courant.com/sns-rt-us-china-stabbingsbre8bd065-20121213,0,5592318.story

The Dems will try to back the opposition into a corner by creative phrasing. Example:

The Child Safety And Protection Act. Who could vote against such a piece of legislation?

My question is the Sig and Glock must have only had a 10 rd. mag. right? High caps are already banned?

billt, you make some very good points.

[Timothy]

My question is the Sig and Glock must have only had a 10 rd. mag. right? High caps are already banned?

CT shot down that legislation, large capacity magazines are legal, at least for the moment.

[tombogan03884]

Mom and Dad divorced. Dad remarried. My own thoughts which dont count for sh*t held grudge over divorce. And that started it all. Dad is high up in a company i saw. Most likely not leaving a lot of time for son. And possibly chose women (maybe many or maybe just new wife) over him. New wife makes Dad so happy something mom could never do. Thus planting the seed mom is at fault for divorce. Or mom initiated the divorce by catching dad in bed with new wife. Thus planting seed its all moms fault. Just my thoughts. Broken young. Never repaired. Mom was too busy probably fixing all the kids at school to realize she may have one damaged at home. Or she could have been the best mother ever and son was born with a bad chip in the brain.

When it comes right down to it, who really gives a crap what personal circumstances influenced this person ?
His brother and Father lived through exactly the same circumstances and seem to be fairly successful and well adjusted.
So the whole BS liberal spiel of "blaming his environment" holds no water.
He was just messed up in the head, his own relatives described him as "obviously disturbed" .
Let's take a look at the incidents I can list off the top of my head.

University of Alabama Huntsville, as a teen the shooter had murdered her brother, it was covered up as an "accident"

Va. Tech shooter was deemed "dangerously unstable" was not supposed to return to school with out treatment. papers were removed from his file.

Aurora Colo, shooter was receiving psychiatric care

Now this guy in Conn "obviously disturbed".
This is not an issue the shooting community or politicians are equipped to address .
This is not about guns, it is about the mental health industry failing the community, and it is about media reminding the disturbed that no matter how meaningless their existence if they go shoot up a mall or school, or movie theater the media will spend days making their name a house hold word .

[tt11758]

I just learned something I did not know.  According to an NYPD Homicide Detective "expert" on Fox News this morning, "hollow-point bullets can penetrate a bulletproof vest".

What a putz.

[Ulmus]

Ok.  I waited. Now to state the obvious. 

Arm the teachers!  Give these people the ability to defend their students. 

We already let them educate and influence our children to the point that the teachers are considered closer than extended family members.  (How often does a kid see their teacher vs. how often they see their Uncle, Aunt, or cousin?)  If we trust them that much with their education and perspectives on events, then we should trust them enough to protect the students as well.

There are teachers out there who are well trained for encounters like this.  Veterans like Ryan Roquin, a Marine that teaches history.  Others that want the ability to protect their students should be given free training.  They could be trained by the local police at their range.

It doesn't have to be mandetory, in fact it shouldn't, but those that want to protect the students the teach and love should have the ability to do so.

[Sponsor]

[JoeG]

Aurora Colo, shooter was receiving psychiatric care

Now this guy in Conn "obviously disturbed".
This is not an issue the shooting community or politicians are equipped to address .
This is not about guns, it is about the mental health industry failing the community, and it is about media reminding the disturbed that no matter how meaningless their existence if they go shoot up a mall or school, or movie theater the media will spend days making their name a house hold word .

I fell into doing these assessments for my company about 15 years ago whenever we ID a person or situation that is creating concern or fear in the workplace (or should be!). I have learned a lot about how hard it is to predict who is actually a threat vs. those that just make threats. The only good way is to prepare and then interview them to get a sense of their reality. mostly they deescalate when someone actually pays attention to them and their tangled emotions.

The mental health system is totally not set up to identify and deal with these rare individuals that actually present a threat. Likely he had been saying and doing things that scared his mother for weeks but she couldn't/wouldn't admit to herself what she was seeing. We know there is a curve of increasing violence that people climb on their way to doing violence to people. Verbal threats, written threats, violence to things, etc. The more times someone climbs the curve without consequences, the faster they climb it next time.

The only way to intervene is early ID and investigation. the legal issues are so messy that most folks do a cursory check and file a report and move on. Does nothing to break the cycle.  It comes down to situational awareness which seems to be a price most folks don't want to pay.

It is much easier to blame the guns than realize that people can be dangerous and we need to act like adults and deal with reality.

Joe

[tombogan03884]

I fell into doing these assessments for my company about 15 years ago whenever we ID a person or situation that is creating concern or fear in the workplace (or should be!). I have learned a lot about how hard it is to predict who is actually a threat vs. those that just make threats. The only good way is to prepare and then interview them to get a sense of their reality. mostly they deescalate when someone actually pays attention to them and their tangled emotions.

The mental health system is totally not set up to identify and deal with these rare individuals that actually present a threat. Likely he had been saying and doing things that scared his mother for weeks but she couldn't/wouldn't admit to herself what she was seeing. We know there is a curve of increasing violence that people climb on their way to doing violence to people. Verbal threats, written threats, violence to things, etc. The more times someone climbs the curve without consequences, the faster they climb it next time.

The only way to intervene is early ID and investigation. the legal issues are so messy that most folks do a cursory check and file a report and move on. Does nothing to break the cycle.  It comes down to situational awareness which seems to be a price most folks don't want to pay.

It is much easier to blame the guns than realize that people can be dangerous and we need to act like adults and deal with reality.

Joe

When I posted I knew there were people like you in the gun community who have an understanding of the real problem . But if you had the power, you would not address it through gun manufacturers or the implements themselves so the generalization worked.

Ok.  I waited. Now to state the obvious. 

Arm the teachers!  Give these people the ability to defend their students. 

We already let them educate and influence our children to the point that the teachers are considered closer than extended family members.  (How often does a kid see their teacher vs. how often they see their Uncle, Aunt, or cousin?)  If we trust them that much with their education and perspectives on events, then we should trust them enough to protect the students as well.

There are teachers out there who are well trained for encounters like this.  Veterans like Ryan Roquin, a Marine that teaches history.  Others that want the ability to protect their students should be given free training.  They could be trained by the local police at their range.

It doesn't have to be mandetory, in fact it shouldn't, but those that want to protect the students the teach and love should have the ability to do so.

It has been successfully used for years in Israel .

http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/310078.aspx

Two Palestinian terrorists disguised in Israel Defense Forces (IDF) uniforms entered the study hall at Makor Haim High School in Kibbutz Kfar Etzion southeast of Jerusalem.

Armed with guns and knives, the terrorists managed to stab several students before armed school counselors arrived and shot them dead.

"The terrorists came inside and began stabbing the students," a defense official said.

"This could have ended much worse," said another in Central Command


It is also done in Thailand

http://old.nationalreview.com/kopel/kopel200409022215.asp

If a teacher can not be trusted with a fire arm the question must be asked .\
 Does that person belong in a class room in the first place ?

[Frosty]

GUN FREE ZONES ARE KILL ZONES!
A guy in CO. has done a map that showed there were 7 movie  theaters within the same amount of travel time as the aurora theater for the wacko that did the shootings.. The aurora theater had posted signs stating "No Weapons allowed" which = GUN FREE ZONE Nobody will oppose me! None of the other theaters had those signs.
I'm starting to see a pattern develop. Sheeple wake up!

[Big Frank]

When are we as a nation going to address the real problem?

[lhprop1]

It has been successfully used for years in Israel .

http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/310078.aspx

Two Palestinian terrorists disguised in Israel Defense Forces (IDF) uniforms entered the study hall at Makor Haim High School in Kibbutz Kfar Etzion southeast of Jerusalem.

Armed with guns and knives, the terrorists managed to stab several students before armed school counselors arrived and shot them dead.

"The terrorists came inside and began stabbing the students," a defense official said.

"This could have ended much worse," said another in Central Command


It is also done in Thailand

http://old.nationalreview.com/kopel/kopel200409022215.asp

If a teacher can not be trusted with a fire arm the question must be asked .\
 Does that person belong in a class room in the first place ?

There are states where it is legal for teachers to carry in class. A teacher can carry in class in MN with written permission from the principal (good luck getting permission, though). There are a few other states where it's legal for teachers to carry. I know Utah is one of them.