Obama backs mosque near ground zero

[fightingquaker13]

Look guys, I ain't happy about this. It makes me mad as Eric. But, and but....., do we throw our principles away? Yeah, Al Queda will do a victory lap when its built, but they'll do one if we don't build it and they can claim that muslims are persecuted. We lose either way. I was against this thing this morning for these two reasons. Now? I think its best to stick to our principles and if they're going to hate us, let them do it for the right reasons. I'll shoot them either way, I'd just prefer not to be misunderstood. And I damn sure won't back down on what I'm for. These assholes shouldn't dictate our policies or change our Constitution. You want to build a temple to a false God on your own land, go nuts. I won't stop you. Its why our country is actually worth fighting for.
FQ13

[texcaliber]

Alright I am sick of this hand-holding-agreeing-crap. If they want to build due to the fact that they caught us off guard and are working a technicality, SO BE IT! I expect the government and powers at hand to place a "Nation out of Debt. Over Night" tax on 'them' for it. That is, after all, the American way and how it is has done past and present.

tex   

P.S. make sure there is little representation to go with that HIGH taxation, so those in question can see our view toward history whilst we are at it.

[sledgemeister]

Is it ideal to believe in total idealism?
Regardless of principles, beliefs, what the laws says, some things are just plain wrong and immoral.

Matches were invented for a reason!

[fightingquaker13]

Is it ideal to believe in total idealism?
Regardless of principles, beliefs, what the laws says, some things are just plain wrong and immoral.

Matches were invented for a reason!

They are what they are.
We are what we are.
Decide where you want to live.
FQ13

[SwoopSJ]

Yeah, Al Queda will do a victory lap when its built, but they'll do one if we don't build it and they can claim that muslims are persecuted. We lose either way.

We may lose either way, however, one way IS worse than the other.  Yes, if the mosque were not allowed to be built, our government would come away with a black eye and the muslims would have fodder for their Anti-American fire.  I would just about guarantee, though, that once the mosque is built there will be a MAJOR uproar.  Huge protests, at least, with violence being extremely likely.   Is it better to look bad because you took a preventative measure against certain catastrophe, or knowingly let it occur to save face?  Wars have been fought and laws enacted in the name of prevention.  This is one of the few times that philosophy could actually pay off.

Swoop

[Sponsor]

[tombogan03884]

I wrote in a post to Eric earlier today that insulting me was pointless as I'm hard to offend. I also wrote that I could be persuaded with reason and mentioned a few times where this board changed my mind on important issues. This is one of them. I was totally against the NY mosque. Then Peter King said this (quoted from the OP):
"President Obama is wrong," said Rep. Peter King, R-N.Y. "It is insensitive and uncaring for the Muslim community to build a mosque in the shadow of ground zero. While the Muslim community has the right to build the mosque they are abusing that right by needlessly offending so many people who have suffered so much."

Ask me when it is Constitutional not to build on private property or worship as you damn well please because it is insensative and might piss folks off?

Not 12 hours ago, I was leaning against the mosque. I still don't like Islam, hate Sharia, and think Al Queda will have a field day with this propaganda wise. I wish it weren't being built. But...when someone in the government says you can't build a house of worship on your own property because the neighbors (including me) will get pissed? Sorry, but thats a gut check for this libertarian. I'd rather the damn thing were left unbuilt, but I'd rather see it built than prevent it as at least it proves we are serious about religious freedom and property rights.
FQ13 who might throw up a little in his mouth for saying that, but sometimes doing the right thing sucks. PS disregard my previous posts. Peter King inadvertantly proved me wrong. Doesn't mean I'm against the gay bar and rib joint, far from it, just that being told that one religion being favored over another, being told you can't do as you please on your own land or that folks have a right not to be offended pisses me off.

Twice in one night, FQ leaves me with a pondering mind. While I will give the fact that FQ has made an INCREDIBLE argument, I am left with the "F' them and the Horse they rode in on!" attitude. I am a sticking to my guns but the Bill of Rights trumps Ego and Hatred.

tex

P.S. knock it off FQ.

The answer is blindingly obvious .
Let them build it,
Torch it later. We up hold our own values by allowing them to build, while still preventing our enemies from having their monument.
To make it even better they get over charged out the wazoo for everything and the site gets looted constantly, the mafia, city, local thives , all helping to relieve these sheep of a little excess wool  
3 bags full  

Eric, No one has ever been booted from the Forum for holding different opinions.
They have been removed for being trouble making A holes.
Think about that then either accept that you disagree with FQ and get over it or I would suggest you leave.

[Rob10ring]

They probably have every right to build the mosque and they probably should have that right, BUT I don't think they are showing very much good will by pursuing it, nor do I believe that they will be receiving much good will back from those that they will offend.

[twyacht]

credit to Haz for the pic:


The name of the book Obama is reading is called:
The Post-American World, and it was written by a fellow Muslim. 

He was reading this prior to his iftar Ramadan dinner at the WH.

Gee....now he supports the mosque?

I wonder how many UNION construction companies will bid and get the job? Or will it have to be built by Islamic companies, as infidels aren't allowed inside?

They are exploiting our own rights regarding property and freedom of religion, because they know they can, and we won't do anything about it.

Sure they could have built it down the road....But the imam, is now "an American ambassador" to help raise money, paid for by us.
Even though his previous remarks about America and 9/11 go forgotten...

This is a slap in the face, and they know it, and with Bloomberg/BHO putting the glove on the imam's hand, we'll get slapped again.

[fightingquaker13]

Heres the funny thing about slaps in the face TW. They don't really hurt, and they aren't even remotely insulting if you smile while taking one. "Did you just slap me? Sorry, I didn't notice. Maybe you should try again so I can be properly offended, because right now I'm just bored and annoyed"  That lesson is courtesy of the Army. The use/abuse of our freedoms? Good, we are who we are. The slap? I didn't feel it because I know what I'm willing to die for and it ain't seventy virgins. Let them them build this, let them insult us. Just keep standing there. But let them know you can knock them on their ass when you want to, but they just aren't worth your time yet. It isn't aout what they are, its about who we are. Yeah, its an insult. Smile, shrug and punch them stupid in afghanistan.
As far as Bo? I've said before he's a waste of space and I'm damn sorry I heard of him, much less voted for him. I don't care what he reads. Unless its Carters memoirs as in "don't screw up like I did", I really don't care. The guy is toast.
FQ13

[PegLeg45]

Heres the funny thing about slaps in the face TW. They don't really hurt, and they aren't even remotely insulting if you smile while taking one. "Did you just slap me? Sorry, I didn't notice.
FQ13

If I slapped you in the face, you'd notice.