Obama backs mosque near ground zero

[tt11758]

I wrote in a post to Eric earlier today that insulting me was pointless as I'm hard to offend. I also wrote that I could be persuaded with reason and mentioned a few times where this board changed my mind on important issues. This is one of them. I was totally against the NY mosque. Then Peter King said this (quoted from the OP):
"President Obama is wrong," said Rep. Peter King, R-N.Y. "It is insensitive and uncaring for the Muslim community to build a mosque in the shadow of ground zero. While the Muslim community has the right to build the mosque they are abusing that right by needlessly offending so many people who have suffered so much."

Ask me when it is Constitutional not to build on private property or worship as you damn well please because it is insensative and might piss folks off?

Not 12 hours ago, I was leaning against the mosque. I still don't like Islam, hate Sharia, and think Al Queda will have a field day with this propaganda wise. I wish it weren't being built. But...when someone in the government says you can't build a house of worship on your own property because the neighbors (including me) will get pissed? Sorry, but thats a gut check for this libertarian. I'd rather the damn thing were left unbuilt, but I'd rather see it built than prevent it as at least it proves we are serious about religious freedom and property rights.
FQ13 who might throw up a little in his mouth for saying that, but sometimes doing the right thing sucks. PS disregard my previous posts. Peter King inadvertantly proved me wrong. Doesn't mean I'm against the gay bar and rib joint, far from it, just that being told that one religion being favored over another, being told you can't do as you please on your own land or that folks have a right not to be offended pisses me off.

FQ, the 1st amendment rights are not an issue, and here's why.  Government entities from NYC to Lizard Lick, NC have always had the right to say you can't put X building in Y location.  It's called zoning.  Nothing unconstitutional in zoning laws.  The only reason you're hearing the 1-A argument is because they figure it will resonate with people who don't think things through.  Atypical of you, I must admit, inasmuch as you have a tendency to overthink most issues.

[twyacht]

from FQ:

But let them know you can knock them on their ass when you want to,

Reference book BHO was reading, in my previous post,.....

Our current POTUS, won't even attempt your quote above, as Appeaser In Chief,.....really?

Take 2 minutes and read this from American Thinker:

http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/08/regarding_ground_zero_bloomberg_misses_the_point.html

small excerpt.

So perhaps rather than focusing on how intolerant we Americans are, Mr. Bloomberg can cut the American people some slack for being nervous when a shady and foreign entity is trying to put a symbol of Allah's divine providence atop the sacred site where Islamic jihad won its greatest victory in centuries. This is especially so when the construction of this mosque could not only embolden Islamic fundamentalists on a global scale, but it could also increase domestic recruiting for the future indoctrination of the cancerous anti-American Islam that plagues many parts of the globe. 

And historically, a slap in the face meant a duel "to the death" at sunrise...

[TAB]

Some to the city of NY to ponder...


If they do build it, how much is it going to cost the city a year?


just think of the law enforcment cost alone, I would not be shocked at all if the bill tops 1 mil in LE alone in the 1st year.  If they are going to let them build it, part of the deal needs to be they pay for increased costs.


I could careless if they build it or not.

[twyacht]

TAB:

I could careless if they build it or not.

If they let infidels build it, put a bid in....., ya' know let's spread the Islamic, and US Gov't wealth around...

[TAB]

having worked on mosque before, they have some very diffrent stuff in them.

example they have benchs infront tof the urnals.  yes the men actually sit to pee.

[Sponsor]

[Pathfinder]

Look at it this way. If the mooslims build this mosque, let another business buy or lease next store, say the gay bar that has been proposed, or a pig butcher. Do you think the mosslims will shriek about how "insensitive" it would be to allow it? Damn right they will, and our spineless politicians and assorted liberals will back them to the hilt.

We are being sold, folks, and sold out. bho's price tag for doing his masters' bidding just might be the islamization of America - which will only further destroy our social, economic and political might in the world.

This whole situation is getting sicker and sicker by the moment. There comes a time in everyone's life when you have to draw a line in the sand - a point past which you shall not push me. This mosque idea is just another shove towards that line - or another click on the stove.

[Hazcat]

Thing is this could be stopped VERY easily!  ConEd (? electric utility there in any case) owns about half the land and is leasing it to them.  All ya got to do is buy that land.

[crusader rabbit]

We are being sold, folks, and sold out. bho's price tag for doing his masters' bidding just might be the islamization of America - which will only further destroy our social, economic and political might in the world.

This whole situation is getting sicker and sicker by the moment. There comes a time in everyone's life when you have to draw a line in the sand - a point past which you shall not push me. This mosque idea is just another shove towards that line - or another click on the stove.

We are being sold out.  And that damned mosque is the line in the sand.  We lose there, well, go ahead and buy some burqas for your wife and daughters.  If America doesn't see this as the slap in the face that it is, we deserve to lose the Republic.

Offered by Crusader Rabbit (who is quietly reflecting on the significance of his avatar).

[ericire12]

Blocking the mosque from being built in that location does not infringe on anyone's right to free religion. There are still countless mosques thoughtout the country that allow any and all muslims to find a place to worship. Remember, its not like anyone is saying they cant build another mosque in this country. People just dont want it built there. They are not trying to create a muslim free zone, and this is in no way a compromise of our constitution.

This is also not unprecedented... You cant just build a church anywhere you want to. It has to obey zoning restrictions and has to not interfere with the community in general. You cant just pop up a 10 story 1st church of whatever in the middle of a subdivision. A city council most definately has the authority to say no to this.

I will also point out that NY officials are bending the laws to actually get this in. The board who must decide if they can tear down the 150 year old building (Which technically they can not) to build this thing has turned a blind eye to to the fact that they are tearing down the building and are actually on record as saying that it would be a great idea to build a mosque there. This is politics. Pure and simple. Why else would Obama make this the time and place that he first speaks about the subject? Why else would he not have said what he said and then went on to try to persuade muslims to be more sympethetic and build somewhere else? Why did no one in the press ever get around to asking him where he stood on this? Why is no one looking into the funding for this thing?





Exit Question for Obama: What took you so long to take a stance on this, Champ? Was Jeremiah Wright on vacation or something?

[Solus]

I've given this some thought.

You may have seen me make posts strongly in support of religious freedom, the freedom to believe in the religion of your choice, or the freedom to not believe in any religion.  I still support that belief.

But, I also feel that the Islam religion should be banned from the US.

It precepts require it's followers to violate the Constitution of the US and the Constitutionally guaranteed rights of US Citizens by requiring them to force non-believers to convert to Islam or become slaves to Islam.  If non-believers do not choose one of those options, they are to be killed.

This simply cannot be tolerated on US soil.

I know the majority of Muslims do not actives pursue these directives of their religion, but they allow it to remain as part of their religious teaching thus insuring that a minority of their members WILL actively pursue these tenets.

Further, I have heard enough from others to believe that even that majority of Muslims who do not adhere to these tenets still believe it is the expected destiny of Islam to succeed in these goals.  

We have seen it posted here that while non-fanatic Muslims are friendly and offer no suggestion of hostility, when pushed, they will reveal that when the "final day" comes and Islam is done using infidels, they will accept conversion or slavery or be killed.  

Even though they may see it in the mists of a mystical  far distant future it has been core to their beliefs from an early age.  They will not act to prevent more active Muslims from forcing those choices today.

If they (those who do not follow these tenets) would act to stop these tenets, we would have seen the results of that action already.  

Has there been any reaction to Imam who teach these tenets?  Any reaction to Imam who teach it as an active and required and immediate duty of Muslims?

Has there been any 'self-policing' of the radical Muslim terrorists?

I have not seen evidence of that.  If Muslims do not actively resist and stop such beliefs, they are supporting those who are acting upon them today.

The Mosque at ground zero should not be banned because it is insensitive to build a Mosque in that location, as FQ stated, but it should be banned along with any Mosque that requires it's believers to violate the Constitution of the US and the rights of US Citizens.