Barrel Harmonics Question RE: Accuracy & Accessories.

[fightingquaker13]

The devistation of a 12ga slug is tough to argue in any use under 100 yards.  Big effect on enemy moral seeing that kind of damage done!

When I was in ROTC, a cadet fell off a 50 foot tower in an obstacle course.What I learned (among other things) is that bleeding and screaming, is bleeding and screaming. It doesn't matter the cause. Everybody from the greenest cadet to the most harded NCO, was shook up to the point of nausea along with that lovely clammy feeling that goes with putting a friend into an ambulance knowing its a waste of gas. I don't care what you shoot him with, you will have his buddies undivided attention, for good or ill. I would chose my weapon based on the likely tactical environment,not anticipated psych effect. Just my .02.
FQ13

[Badgersmilk]

A good point.  And head shots from any caliber rarely go without drama!

[fightingquaker13]

Badgersmilk
Tell me a little abot that bag you've got. It looks handy. Also what kind of scope and what kind of accuracy are you getting out of that M77? I havea B@L Elite 3000 in .270 on mine and love it, but I always want to learn.
FQ13

[Badgersmilk]

the bags from VooDoo Tactical.  Holds two long guns (the 26" barreled M77 JUST fits) and two pistols, binoculars, spare mags for each, spotting scope, range finder, Ghilli wrap for the M77, and a bunch of other crap (yes this makes for one HEAVY puppy!), but its super durrable, and came with backpack straps I use instead of the shoulder strap (did I mention its HEAVY?).  Grab this one bag, a small duffel with a Ghilli poncho and other crap in it, several ammo cans and your all set to travel (maybe not through an airport though!)

The scope:   http://www.bushnell.com/general/riflescopes_elite3200_32-1040m.cfm

As far as accuracy...  Thats all about me.  Has nothing to do with the gun, ammo (hand loads), sights, rest, the trigger (breaks clean at 13 oz.) or anything else.  That stuff's all proven 100% reliable, and consistant.  I have NO excuses there.  I know the gun outshoots me.  When I can settle my stupid butt down.  Start using my brain, and go through my check list, I'll consistantly stay in 1.2" at 200 yards.  Not muraculouse.  And no fault of the hardware.  That's just me (when I use my brain).  Shooting one group thats .19" at that range doesnt prove anything unless you can do it every time.  I cant!

Could probably do better with more scope, and if I shot more, but more scope isnt practical for what the gun was built for.  (Quick aquisition & fire at range).  And given the amount of time it takes me to hand load precision rounds...  I dont care to burn through them any faster than I already do!

[Texas_Bryan]

Could probably do better with more scope, and if I shot more, but more scope isnt practical for what the gun was built for.  (Quick aquisition & fire at range).  And given the amount of time it takes me to hand load precision rounds...  I dont care to burn through them any faster than I already do!

Plus 1 on the 12g, a slug is alot of lead, and 7 or 8 rounds of 9 pellet .30 cal buck is more, that's 72 piece of lead faster than any AR or AK, its effectiveness in certain situations could be argued though.  You ever looked at a Jeff Cooper style scout rifle?

[Sponsor]

[fightingquaker13]

1.2" at 200 yards is damn solid. I can shoot .75" at 100 yds on the range and put the first two out of three on a beer can at two hundred (the third shot is iffy, but damn close, hence my interest in the doughnut to compensate for the barrel heating up). I don't understand why more folks don't look at the Ruger before going to the rem 700 as a default. Just because the army chose it doesn't mean its better.Hell, compare the the Glock to the Berretta as exhibit A. Anyway, thanks for the info on the bag.
FQ13

[Badgersmilk]

Fire two shots within a minute, then wait about 10 minutes and fire the third.  Some barrels are more sensitive to fouling than others.  It could be this rather than heat causing your third shot problem.  Could also be the ammo, or the load your using is causing excessive fouling in your particular gun.  Check those things before you spend any money modifying the gun.  I dont think you can go wrong with Cryo treat though.  (I put A LOT of work into tuning my M77...  If your using the factory scope rings you might consider going to Burris steel ones to.  Helped my gun!)

I love Ruger's, have several I'm super happy with (little .44 carbine may be my favorite).  But every model I've seen you had to be SUPER carefull looking over their guns before buying one.  All their guns I've looked at I could pick one or more out of the bunch that'd been VERY well built.  Then I'd find one or more that were JUNK.  Rugers problem has been consistancy in quality ever since the mid. 80's.  If you dont look SUPER close its a crap shoot.  Still one of my favorite manufactures of all time though!

Rem. 700's...  The factory stock guns dont impress me in the least.  Aftermarket stuff is plentiful, as are special models (m24), and as nice as you care to pay for.

[PegLeg45]

While installing some water lines to some pecan trees this morning, I thought of something that might readily demonstrate M25's excellent 'diving board' analogy from one of his earlier posts regarding barrel harmonics.

Take a piece of 3/4" PVC pipe and hold it in the middle and shake it. Then drop a marble or anything that will roll down it into one end, while still shaking the pipe. There are no guarantees where the object will go when it exits the pipe.
It's a very exaggerated example, but still shows what barrel flex will do.
Stiffen the pipe, or remove as much flex as possible, and you can control where the object goes a little better.

Same thing with rifle barrel harmonics.

The rubber dampeners remove some of the excess vibration.

Accuracy kinda boils down to timing, in a way, though. You are basically timing when the bullet leaves the barrel, during the vibration cycle of the barrel. Thinner barrels flex and 'whip' more than thicker more rigid barrels, but all barrels flex to some degree. I've seen benchrest barrels that were 2" in diameter to try to remove flex, just to shoot a 6mm bullet. But a 2" barrel ain't real handy in the deer woods.

Bottom line, remove as much vibration (harmonics) and as many other variables as possible and then work up the load (or test factory ammo) to find the round that is most consistent at leaving the barrel at the same time in the cycle of movement. Also bearing in mind that the load itself will have an effect on the vibration cycle, but you have to start somewhere.


This has been posted several times........Watch at about the 00:27 mark.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5pVya7eask

[Badgersmilk]

Sure makes it easy to see where cheap scopes would fail on any kind of rifle!!!  Even 1/4 of that flex is mighty tough on something precisely holding little peices of glass!

[tombogan03884]

  That is the only major problem I've found with the Soviet weapons, near/ Far require different calibers.