did M1 carbines really fail to penetrate chinese clothing at Chosin?

[r_w]

the m1 was designed and spected for a gun that was inbetween a hand gun and a rifle.  it was to be issued to non combative troups.  It was  only after the "handyness" of the rifle was descovered that combat troups used them.

And by handyness you mean a lot less weight to hump. 

Same reason people carry .380's for CCW today.

[tombogan03884]

I wonder if the carbine would be better if it was chambered for the .357 magnum round.

What do you think?

Definitely ! the .357 has showed it's capabilities in lever guns for years, M25 told me about a guy he knows that does that, custom m-1's in better calibers, I know he mentioned .357, but there were others as well, 44 and 10mm IIRC.

[r_w]

M1 carbine in 10 mm 

[TAB]

M1 carbine in 10 mm 

i'll raise you 7.62 tok or 9x25 dillon.

[tombogan03884]

Could it be done in 454 ?
TAB, the only problem I see with the 7.62 X 25 is in bullets, far as I know all that is available is ball ammo.
The others have been used in hunting and SD enough for there to be a wider variety of projectile designs available.
Seems to have plenty of velocity though.

[Sponsor]

[Big Frank]

.357 is less powerful than .30 carbine. I don't think it would perform any better with ball ammo.

[m25operator]

A .30 carbine will penetrate completely an old creosote covered telephone pole, it does have penetration, I talked to Corbon and Hornaday many yrs ago about making and XTP bullet for it and Corbon beefing it up a bit, but alas no action, although they were both interested. Hard to find these days, but a friend of mine was working on loading the sabot Remington bullets in .30 Mauser/Tokarev in theory, a 45 -50 grain .224 bullet in a sabot, would do over 2k fps, still has not scienced it out. But good idea. This would be out of a Tokarev or Broom handle mauser.

[tombogan03884]

.357 is less powerful than .30 carbine. I don't think it would perform any better with ball ammo.

Even if that were accurate the fact remains that while the .30 Carbine is limited to FMJ, the .357 is not.

M25, I seldom disagree with you but this time I must, back in the early 90's I did side by side penetration tests with the .30 Carbine M-1, 9mm pistol, and .357 Revolver. While the .357 and 9mm had no problem penetrating .060 cold rolled sheet mtal the Carbine merely left a dent with a split at the bottom before bouncing off, .125 aluminum stopped it cold, until I got divorced I had the plate with the  carbine round stuck in it with the Magnum and 9mm holes on either side.

[PupSter]

Could it be done in 454 ?
TAB, the only problem I see with the 7.62 X 25 is in bullets, far as I know all that is available is ball ammo.
The others have been used in hunting and SD enough for there to be a wider variety of projectile designs available.
Seems to have plenty of velocity though.

They do magsafe rounds, JHP as well as FMJ in 7.62x25mm as well as a sabot round using a 5.56mm bullet... Not sure about a soft point... yet anyways...

[seeker_two]

One other thing to consider....a lot of Chinese and NK soldiers, knowing that they'd be part of a human wave charge, would put pieces of scrap metal inside their coats to ac as an ersatz trauma plate. Of course, .30 Carbine wouldn't have a chance against that...even some .30-06 would have trouble penetrating that at distance...